Origin 20 or DSL20 for brightest clean tones?

[december]

How close is the Origin 20 to the green/classic gain channel of the DSL20CR/HR? I had a DSL20CR and sold it because the ultra gain channel did not work out for me. I got my high gain sound taken care of now but I was listening to old recordings of the DSL and realized that those clean tones were so much brighter than anything I'm able to get with what I have now.
So I'm thinking about getting a DSL20HR just for the clean channel, but if I only need the clean channel, I should just get the 1-channel Origin that costs less... But does it sound the same? Is it really bright like that?
Thanks for any insight.

 

[fitz]

So I'm thinking about getting a DSL20HR just for the clean channel, but if I only need the clean channel, I should just get the 1-channel Origin that costs less... But does it sound the same? Is it really bright like that?

I've had both.
My vote for cleans only (between the 2) would be the DSL.

The O20 is clean at low volume, and can be set to a bright tone, but the more you drive the circuit, the more crunchy it will get.
The separate gain and Master volumes can be deceiving - they work together and are different than the way the gain and volume work on the DSL channels.

You may also want to consider the Origin 50.
It can stay cleaner at much higher volumes, but it still behaves like the 20 as it gets pushed.

 

[december]

I've had both.
My vote for cleans only (between the 2) would be the DSL.

The O20 is clean at low volume, and can be set to a bright tone, but the more you drive the circuit, the more crunchy it will get.
The separate gain and Master volumes can be deceiving - they work together and are different than the way the gain and volume work on the DSL channels.

You may also want to consider the Origin 50.
It can stay cleaner at much higher volumes, but it still behaves like the 20 as it gets pushed.

Thanks. I don't need high volume, just recording in an apartment. Though I can be quite a bit louder than most apartments would tolerate, I never need to turn it past 40-50%.
The DSL20CR with gain ~2-3 gave me a great, bright clean tone. More gain made it darker with a lot more low-mids. I need clean cleans, no breakup.
I watched a comparison on YT and the DSL sounds brighter. They said it's a "cleaner clean". And the Origin had a lot more mids (that I don't like). I already know I liked the DSL20CR clean so I should probably get a DSL20HR, since I have the speakers I need already.
I got so fixated on finding the right tight & chuggy high gain tone (which I now have) that I didn't realize I had lost my ideal clean tone when I sold the DSL20CR. It was so bright that distortion pedals sounded absolutely horrid into it, but the ultra gain channel was muddy and fizzy, so it wasn't able to provide cleans AND high gain for me, so I sold it to get something else, not knowing that the next 3 amps I would buy would not have a clean tone near as bright as the DSL. I have the high gain tone I need now, but I wish I still had that DSL clean channel...

 

[steveb63]

My vote- DSL.
For all the reasons stated above^^^^^

 

[Antti Heikkinen]

DSL is much "cleaner" and tight even at volume, Origin is much warmer and more vintage 'soft' tone, and pushed gets dirty in a kinda nasty single pream tube way, although it gets some plexi kinda vibes then too. The DSL is better as is, more versatile.

Origin 50 then is clearly more snappy and tight than 20, thanks to more power and headroom, but IMO doesn't quite have the warmth of the 20 at any setting.

I'd say the 20 is a superb pedal platform for home or a quiet band, very nice earthy and warm, even downright saggy tones, and the 50 is a great pedal platform for playing with even louder band. I don't like the stock driven tones of either due to single preamp tube always sounding buzzy vintage drive when pushed hard, but they do take pedals well.

Hence I've modded both a 20 and the 50 with the same 'headfirst' mod. Don't recommend it for anyone not professional with amp techs and electrics, but if you are competent, they are HELLUVA mods. I have however made them much less driven than the original mod, by using a 10K cathode follower resistor instead of 2.7K, which I like WAY better because then they can still be used as crunchy pedal platforms, and otherwise following the mod to a tee. What it does it robs the loop driver tube converting it to a second preamp tube, and makes the amps simply awesome ACDC style machines. They get a little noisy too, however, and if you want a loop, you can install a zero loss loop later, which is also available even as a ready-populated board from Jason Tong at Headfirst.

I've owned plexis, several JCM800s and to me the 20 and 50 when modded with this lower gain version of HF mod are on par with a 2204 which to me is the ultimate driven Marshall ACDC/rock amp, altough a little noisier.

But if you aren't looking to mod them, consider them pedal platforms, 20 for home and 50 for band playing.

 

[bhatta]

Haven't played a O50. But compared by DSL20CR to O20, for what you are looking for, I absolutely agree with @fitz

A DSL is what you are looking for.

 

[december]

Haven't played a O50. But compared by DSL20CR to O20, for what you are looking for, I absolutely agree with @fitz

A DSL is what you are looking for.

I had a DSL20CR, so I know that's the clean I like. Had an ECC832 in V1 to drop the gain on the green channel, and KT77 power tubes.
Was hoping the Origin might be the same, since I don't need the ultra gain channel, and Origin costs less. But I watched a comparison and the Origin is darker with way more mids... Not what I need.
I sold the DSL20CR because I couldn't get the chuggy high gain tone I needed from it, even with a Precision Drive and parametric EQ, not knowing that the next 3 amps I would buy would not be capable of a bright & shiny clean tone like that.

 

[jeffb]

How close is the Origin 20 to the green/classic gain channel of the DSL20CR/HR?

Not close at all.

DSLs and Origins are nearly polar opposites in every important way- tone/EQ, feel, dynamics.

 

[Mark Collier]

Don;t expell me for this....If your looking for clean, cleans that aren;t too middy and warm, why not consder a fender?

I recently picked up a used Fender Princeton Chorus (Yes SS) not tube) and the clean sound is SO different to any Marshall, a great clean recording tone and the crunch tone is pretty cool too...kind of its own thing.

Maybe something different within your collection, is mostly what I'm getting at.

 

[december]

Don;t expell me for this....If your looking for clean, cleans that aren;t too middy and warm, why not consder a fender?

I recently picked up a used Fender Princeton Chorus (Yes SS) not tube) and the clean sound is SO different to any Marshall, a great clean recording tone and the crunch tone is pretty cool too...kind of its own thing.

Maybe something different within your collection, is mostly what I'm getting at.

Because I had a DSL20CR and I know I liked the clean channel. I had an ECC832 in V1 to drop the gain on the green channel and KT77 power tubes.
But the ultra gain channel was horrible... muddy and fizzy, not good for chugs. So I sold it to get something else, not knowing that the next amps I would get wouldn't have very bright cleans. I got my high gain sound down now, but I'm missing that clean from the DSL.

 

[vivanchenko]

The Origin can be very much brighter than most reviews will lead you to believe. It has the "tilt" knob, which very successfully emulates the bright and normal channels of 4 hole amps. Most reviewers have it somewhere in between of the two "channels". If you dime it, then the amp will sound as bright as the bright channels of 4 holers.

I agree that the 20W Origin will start to break up early, but if you use a 12AU1 for V1 it might clean it up considerably. Actually, it would be interesting to try how it works. I have a 15W DSL and to me the Origin sounds nicer than DSL's green channel. Not sure about the DSL 20 though.

Also, the Origin has the "boost" function, which will noticeably increase clean headroom. It doesn't add compression at all.

 

[vicenzzopaiva]

I already have an Origin 20H and really like the drive tones of it, although it would be nice to have a more versatile amp with a second channel or reverb. that said, a friend offered me a trade with a DSL20HR and it got me searching about it. The ultra gain channel sounds not great in the reviews i saw, but the classic gain sound great even with the gain maxed out…
seeing you say the ultra gain on yours was bad kind of reaffirms that for me, but i’m not looking for a metal amp on that DSL

i’m really thorn about this should i keep what i like and live with it’s flaws or try a more versatile (on paper) amp that i’ll need to learn how to like it?

 

[fitz]

The ultra gain channel sounds not great in the reviews i saw, but the classic gain sound great even with the gain maxed out…
seeing you say the ultra gain on yours was bad kind of reaffirms that for me, but i’m not looking for a metal amp on that DSL

There are ways of taming the DSL20 Ultra Channel with lower gain factor pre-amp tubes.
With the cathode bias, you also have the option of running a few different types of power tubes without needing to reset the bias.
Speaker choice can also help mellow out the amp tones.

 

[NumbSkull]

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Also the line6 Catalyst CX is worth a look.

Digi amps do cleans well, and have swirly FX built in.

 

[Mike_LA]

Best Clean
Best Breakup
Best OD
No Pedals
'Nuf said.

 

[Bull Rock]

 

[fitz]

View attachment 152277

That's a cool pedal mod with the mid focused frequency bands.
But to that point, EQ in the loop on either the Origin20 or the DSL20 can make a major change in how you can shape the tone of these amps.

 

[Bull Rock]

That's a cool pedal mod with the mid focused frequency bands.
But to that point, EQ in the loop on either the Origin20 or the DSL20 can make a major change in how you can shape the tone of these amps.

Yes sir! And...put one out front too is a lot of flexibility. I was suggesting trying an eq before offloading a great amp. You can use the loop one and bring the output level down to use it as a faux attenuator as well instead of set flat or a solo boostah. Quite the tone shaper.