DSL20CR question

[Gene Ballzz]

@DirkD
FIRST> to the forum & HNAD!
THEN> @Chris-in-LA , @fitz288 , @scozz ,
As much as I love you folks, I must state that you are simply wrong about the DSL20 and everything happening in the preamp! I own DSL5C, DSL40CR and DSL20CR. The 20 is unique in that while yes, the driven preamp can sound kinda OK like the other DSLs, the power section (when cranked) really gives up some old school goods that none of the other DSL models will even come close to! I run the CLASSIC channel with GAIN and VOLUME floored and ULTRA channel with VOLUME floored and GAIN, between 9:00 and 11:00 to balance well with the other channel. If Marshall makes enough of them and longevity/repairs aren't too bad, I estimate that in future "vintage" circles these may well rival Deluxe Reverb amps! More features than the DR, Marshall grind, nice EFFECTS LOOP and the best sounding reverb of the whole DSL lineup!

As for the attenuator, a great attenuator works fantastically with this amp. I cannot speak for the Bugera PS1, but the Weber MiniMass works "mostly OK" at a couple or three spots on the dial and the @JohnH passive reactive/resistive unit (linked below) is the best you can get in the affordable price range, although you need to build it yourself or have someone else do it for you!

https://www.marshallforum.com/threads/simple-attenuators-design-and-testing.98285/

Just My ,
Gene

 

[nickfox]

Only downside is that the old tinnitus is flaring up a little......

Because of my tinnitus, I need to get rid of that hiss, even though it isn't too bad........

Hey Dirk, welcome to the channel. I have tinnitus in my right ear that hurts when I turn music up too loud so I know how you feel. If you don't have one, I recommend getting an SPL meter off of ebay for 15 bucks or so. You can also download a free sound pressure level app onto your phone but I think it's well worth buying a dedicated meter. I have a DSL40CR 3 feet behind me on the floor while I sit here at my desk and it averages about 85dB. It's my daily player and you can talk over it. It sounds excellent and doesn't hurt my ear.

85dB may not be appropriate for your tinnitus, but with one of those meters, you can start taking measurements and figure out what is.

About the hiss, my DSL40CR hissed when I bought it and I returned it to Thomanns in Germany telling them I can't record with it. They sent it back and it still hissed. I contacted Marshall customer support in England and they said send it back to Thomanns and give us the work order #. It came back this time without a hiss and certainly no hum.

That was the long story, but the short story is send the amp back and demand one without any hiss or hum. At all. And contact Marshall if you're not fully satisfied. They will deliver.

If Marshall makes enough of them and longevity/repairs aren't too bad, I estimate that in future "vintage" circles these may well rival Deluxe Reverb amps!

Hey Gene, didn't you have both a DSL20CR and HR at one time?

I've been thinking about getting a DSL20HR. I've been up to Thomanns twice to check out amps and both times I was up there, I felt that the DSL20HR sounded BETTER than the DSL40CR (which I own).

Is the DSL20CR and DSL20HR the same circuit?

And do you think that the DSL20 sounds better than the DSL40CR?

 

[Gene Ballzz]

DSL20CR and DSL20HR are identical except for face/back panels and orientation. Yeah, the 20 sounds better when cranked, with or without an attenuator, but the 40CR does a better job at really low volumes, no attenuator needed! I still prefer the 20 with an attenuator!
Go Figure?
Gene

 

[ITburst]

I have the dsl20h and 212 cab on order. Tried a combo in the store to get a sense of how low it will go. I was impressed!
The 212 should sound even better I hope, not that the combo was bad.
Glad I won’t need a attenuator but will hold onto the idea as an option

 

[fitz]

I have the dsl20h and 212 cab on order. Tried a combo in the store to get a sense of how low it will go. I was impressed!
The 212 should sound even better I hope, not that the combo was bad.
Glad I won’t need a attenuator but will hold onto the idea as an option

to the forum!
And, congratulations on your new Marshall.
May you have many more.

 

[Chris-in-LA]

At low volume it’s practically impossible to tell the difference between preamp distortion and attenuated power tube distortion.

Just my 2 cents!

 

[scozz]

@DirkD
FIRST> to the forum & HNAD!
THEN> @Chris-in-LA , @fitz288 , @scozz ,
As much as I love you folks, I must state that you are simply wrong about the DSL20 and everything happening in the preamp! I own DSL5C, DSL40CR and DSL20CR. The 20 is unique in that while yes, the driven preamp can sound kinda OK like the other DSLs, the power section (when cranked) really gives up some old school goods that none of the other DSL models will even come close to! I run the CLASSIC channel with GAIN and VOLUME floored and ULTRA channel with VOLUME floored and GAIN, between 9:00 and 11:00 to balance well with the other channel. If Marshall makes enough of them and longevity/repairs aren't too bad, I estimate that in future "vintage" circles these may well rival Deluxe Reverb amps! More features than the DR, Marshall grind, nice EFFECTS LOOP and the best sounding reverb of the whole DSL lineup!

As for the attenuator, a great attenuator works fantastically with this amp. I cannot speak for the Bugera PS1, but the Weber MiniMass works "mostly OK" at a couple or three spots on the dial and the @JohnH passive reactive/resistive unit (linked below) is the best you can get in the affordable price range, although you need to build it yourself or have someone else do it for you!

https://www.marshallforum.com/threads/simple-attenuators-design-and-testing.98285/

Just My ,
Gene

You’re absolutely right Gene, that’s what I thought 2 months ago. I thought the 20 was the same as the rest of the Dsl line, getting the gain only from the preamp section.

It wasn’t until I read one of your posts somewhere, where I heard you talking about it. I have respect for your opinions and knowledge, so I corrected myself as soon as the opportunity came about.

I’ve made comments in other posts since then, commenting about the 20 being different from the other Dsls, in that it drives the power tubes, as well as the preamp tubes.

Just the record Buddy.

 

[ITburst]

Being new to tube amps, and still waiting for my Dsl20h and cab to arrive can I confirm if the combo and the separate head will both function identically?
I am unsure about the whole preamp and power section intricacies. What I do know is that the dsl20c combo I tried in the store could produce full on gain at very, very low volume. This is what I want as I did not want to go the attenuator route.
Am I correct in this?

 

[fitz]

can I confirm if the combo and the separate head will both function identically?

Yep, identical.
As @Gene Ballzz pointed out, the only difference is the face plates and orientation (tubes up in the head, tubes down in the combo).
Attenuator is not required for high gain at low volume.
Most agree Marshalls just sound better loud.
A cranked amp through an attenuator will give a different tone than just a master/channel volume before the power section.
But there's always a trade off in attenuator tone and speakers not being pushed by a loud amp.
What combination sounds best is a matter of preference, but again, there's no substitute for volume.

 

[ITburst]

Thanks Fitz288. I know I tried the Origin20 back to back with the dsl20, both combo’s. I actually preferred the Origin sound but that amp really relies on pure volume for break up as it’s only a single channel amp. More the kind of distortion I like. However, I’m not going to say I dislike the dsl20 sound. Both are great but had they both worked the same way I probably would have gone with the Origin20.

I did have a few emails back and forth with Marshall who also stated the same thing, I just like to get as much feedback as I can from different sources. What better place than a forum full of Marshall owners. Cheers!

 

[ITburst]

Ah!! It just struck me after your tube orientation comment. I was wondering why the combo and the head have all the controls reversed. Now I know why.

The more I talk about this amp, the more excited I am about getting it but it’s going to be another month or so before it gets to me in Canada. I have a brother who lives in Kent. I told him to pop round Milton Keynes and get Marshall to sort themselves

 

[fitz]

Thanks Fitz288. I know I tried the Origin20 back to back with the dsl20, both combo’s. I actually preferred the Origin sound but that amp really relies on pure volume for break up as it’s only a single channel amp. More the kind of distortion I like. However, I’m not going to say I dislike the dsl20 sound. Both are great but had they both worked the same way I probably would have gone with the Origin20.

I did have a few email back and forth with Marshall who also stated the same thing, I just like to get as much feedback from as I can from different sources. What better place than a forum full of Marshall owners. Cheers!

I have both.
Some tube changes and speaker choices can get more growl out of the Origin20 and can mellow out the high gain in the DSL20.
And, if you don't recoil in horror at the thought of using a pedal or two, you can get just about any tone you want out of either.
I have a pedal train on my Origin that probably cost me more than the amp, and the ME-80 on the DSL is like having dozens of pedals to choose from.
Don't worry about second guessing the DSL20 purchase, it's a f@©king great amp!

 

[ITburst]

Thanks again Fitz, and I’m not adverse to sticking a pedal or 7 into it. I’m sure between my Santa Ana overdrive or my Blues Driver, in front of the clean channel, I will find some nice tone.

 

[ITburst]

Just got it today. It’s amazing!