Gibson SG's, New Production VS Older

[maltone]

Yesterday I acquired a used 2006 Black Gibson SG Standard for 850.00 Canadian. As a comparison, the day before, I tried a NEW SG Standard, priced at 1180.00 Canadian — on sale, and including taxes.

I remember this 2012 SG feeling very light, and a bit "clucky" sounding. The fret board seemed grainy, or loose feeling. When I tapped the body with my knuckle, it had a kind of hollow "CLUCK" or "CLOCK" sound. It didn't make an impression on me, and felt extraordinarily light, like it could slip off my lap easily.

The older 2006 I tried yesterday was HEAVY, much heavier feeling than the 2012 model. The neck is hard as rock, the fretboard is smooth, has an extremely tight grain, with black striping throughout, and an even smooth, fast feel. The body, WOW — is almost hard like marble, when I tapped it with my knuckle, it made this CLICK sound. It's dense, very hard and almost plays like a solid bodied Les Paul. We actually referred to it as a thinner Les Paul.

The store owner who is a Luthier had a weight guage on hand. He put the hook under one of the machine head tuners and weighed it, suspended in air. The weight came in at 7.7 pounds. This thing is CHUNKY. The neck is perfect, girthy, fat, but not too fat, and the string vibration is unbelievable.

I wonder why Gibson doesn't make all of them this way. It feels old school. It makes me glad I bought this used one — instead of a new one.

 

[Dogs of Doom]

Is the bridge stud/insert mounted?

I had an SG in the '90s that the bridge studs were mounted directly into the wood (no inserts) & it moved around so much the intonation was impossible to keep. I'm not sure of the details, but someone fell asleep at the wheel on that one.

That would be my only caveat. Make sure it has the inserts. If not, have inserts installed for stability, or get a different one.

 

[maltone]

Hey DOD, it does have inserts, and correction, it wasn't 9 pounds, it was 7.7. But, for some reason, it feels heavier, and much more dense. SOLID.

The bridge posts go into the inserts. But, I'm going to buy this kit by Faber at CV Guitars.

The first part is called iNserts Faber iNsert Steel bridge Studs - CV Guitars

After that's installed, you can install a Faber Tone Lock Bridge: CV Guitars
The bridge posts are locked in place by these dual threaded stainless steel barrels, and they lock into the bridge post holes. I asked a really good Luthier in my city to install this kit on a Gretsch, and it is AWESOME. Sustain, springiness in the strings, a TON of energy return - for days. You don't have to hit the strings hard, ever. My Gretsch came alive when I installed this kit.

The best part is, ALL the parts are solid stainless steel, machined from solid pieces, no cast parts here. Also see http://cvgshop.com/images/IMG_6675%20%28Medium%29%20%282%29.jpg

After the installation on my Gretsch, NOTHING moved, ever. It was as if the bridge and the guitar top were one piece, and it resonates as if it is one piece. Absolutely amazing, and possibly one of the best upgrades you could ever do for your guitar.

 

[johnfv]

Looks like a great find! Every guitar is different, but in my experience with recent Gibons it has become harder and harder to find a "good one" unless you go Custom Shop and spend big bucks.

 

[HeHasTheJazzHands]

Usually when it comes to tone woods like Mahogany... The lighter the specimen, the higher the quality of it.

 

[diesect20022000]

Usually when it comes to tone woods like Mahogany... The lighter the specimen, the higher the quality of it.

you'd love my SG. it's not even 5lbs lol and NOT NECK HAVY!

thing resonates like noones business. not a huge amount of sustain though sadly but it has some of the best tone i've had in an SG and i've had quite a few. i'm an SG nut. i started an SG thread here in fact.

 

[Wycked Lester]

i'd like to have a SG,...never have, but they always sound good.

as far as old vs new gibsons go, to me, the pre 1985's blow anything new out of the water..... no comparison. ....none.

 

[HeHasTheJazzHands]

Well if I can ever get the bux, these would be my dream SGs.

 

[maltone]

I don't really "know" guitars, I'm a basement hack, but I love that thick midrange thing the SG gets, but I'm not too fond of this 498T bridge pickup.

I tried my brother in law's Dean Z last week, he had a DiMarzio DP100 in the bridge, and it absolutely blew my head off. It was so damn thick, the top end was bright, yet restrained, almost sounded recorded, — muscled is a good word to describe it.

At any rate, I'm not sure what kind of bridge pickup would give that tight, thick mid range, but detailed, and articulated. I'm thinking maybe there's a trade-off somewhere. I'm coming from a Gretsch Powerjet with a TV Jones Powertron Plus bridge - like a cross between a Gibson PAF and a Gretsch Filtertron. LOTS of jangle, some chunk, but not enough midrange.

The only reason why I thought the DP100 would be good, is because it drove the amp so easily at a lower volume - even cleaned up with the bridge volume turned lower 5-6 etc, it STILL sounded really good.

What are you guys using in your SG's for bridge only?

 

[HeHasTheJazzHands]

I think this:

 

[richieG]

I have owned a lot of SGs over the years. I do not seek them out, I just seem to end up with them.

I have a late 70s that I got when I was 21...to be honest..... It sounds good, but is pretty crappy. I have been meaning to make it a slide guitAr.

The new ones are ok, but they feel very generic.

Oddly the best one I have is like you describe, bigger neck, heavy for a SG, great to play. It's a 95 I think. It is finished badly with bad inlaying and shitty paint work, but it's the best one I have played. Really really good to play, sounds good as well.

I also have used a 68 custom.....really nice. Fat neck, ( which I like) great wood.

They are a great practical no nonsense guitar. Great for the stage.

 

[maltone]

HeHasTheJazzHands — LOVE your guitar. That's probably what I should have. I'm a "bridge only" kind of tone junkie. I can't even play that well, but I love that damn bridge honk. I love the simplicity of your guitar, and as RichieG described, "no nonsense" - I'm all about that. HeHas, what bridge pickup do you have in that beautiful, streamlined classic babe?

If you guys love SG's or Les Pauls for that matter, you should really take a serious look at the CV Guitars site. I can't talk enough about the Faber parts they carry. If you hold your old stock Gibson bridge in one hand, then hold the Faber Tone Lock bridge in the other, the comparison is like holding a cheap zinc metal combination lock from the dollar store in one hand, and a steel padlock in the other. — Ok, not that exaggerated, but the weight, density, and quality of that solid machined part after it's installed... it's immediately noticeable.

My Gretsch Powerjet had a space control bridge originally, and they suck!. I had the faber tone lock bridge installed, and compared it side by side to a NEW Gretsch Jet that cost $2800.00 new, and had an ABR1 style bridge on TOP of a floating, unpinned rosewood base, and my Gretsch with the Faber bridge just felt better, easier to play, sustained for days, more touch sensitive, everything just felt more immediate and tactile. They're fantastic.

So, bridge pickup suggestions for this SG? I'm not into "metal". I like rock n' roll, classic stuff.

 

[50WPLEXI]

Man, that's like the best looking SG I've seen in a while. It looks tight, and solid.

 

[Rozman62]

Yesterday I acquired a used 2006 Black Gibson SG Standard for 850.00 Canadian. As a comparison, the day before, I tried a NEW SG Standard, priced at 1180.00 Canadian — on sale, and including taxes.

I remember this 2012 SG feeling very light, and a bit "clucky" sounding. The fret board seemed grainy, or loose feeling. When I tapped the body with my knuckle, it had a kind of hollow "CLUCK" or "CLOCK" sound. It didn't make an impression on me, and felt extraordinarily light, like it could slip off my lap easily.

The older 2006 I tried yesterday was HEAVY, much heavier feeling than the 2012 model. The neck is hard as rock, the fretboard is smooth, has an extremely tight grain, with black striping throughout, and an even smooth, fast feel. The body, WOW — is almost hard like marble, when I tapped it with my knuckle, it made this CLICK sound. It's dense, very hard and almost plays like a solid bodied Les Paul. We actually referred to it as a thinner Les Paul.

The store owner who is a Luthier had a weight guage on hand. He put the hook under one of the machine head tuners and weighed it, suspended in air. The weight came in at 7.7 pounds. This thing is CHUNKY. The neck is perfect, girthy, fat, but not too fat, and the string vibration is unbelievable.

I wonder why Gibson doesn't make all of them this way. It feels old school. It makes me glad I bought this used one — instead of a new one.

Bought this 2011 std a few months ago for under $700. The seller paid $1150 for it earlier this year so his loss was my gain. It was mint condition. I never weighed it but guess it is under 6 lbs. It has incredible low action with zero fret buzz. The fretboard is a little rough but that is ok with me. Need to get some lemon oil on it soon. It has a 498T in the bridge. I find keeping the tone knob around 6-ish territory removes that shrill type tone often associated with this pup. Many like the Gibby '57's in there SG. I play through Marshall's, Orange and Blackstar amps and this axe delivers the goods thru all of my rigs.

 

[maltone]

Rozman62, very nice. Mine does have some normal wear on it, near the arm rest, some light swirl marks on the back etc. But, once we cleaned it, it shines, looks damn good, but it's the way it plays. Not ever setup properly.

Today, I went over to my brother in law's place. He has a DSL-100 exactly like mine, we've AB'd the amps in the same room before, same guitar, same settings, to get a baseline of "sameness". But today we plugged my Gretsch into the head through a MESA 4X12 cab with V30's.

The Gretsch, although it has the the highest output bridge pickup that TV Jones makes is somewhere between a classic Gibson PAF, and a Gretsch Filtertron. Lots of jangle, some grit, but very articulate, detailed, upper registers chime etc. But, a bit looser sounding.

Next, we plugged in my used SG, and it sucked. Those 498T bridge pickups absolutely suck. But I was prepared for that, and have been debating what pickup I should replace it with.

Next, we plugged in my brother in law's Dean Z (see attached image). It has a DiMarzio Super Distortion in the bridge! WOW! The name it's been given isn't accurate at all, because it wasn't "distorted" at all. This was so damn warm, classic, I heard specific AC/DC songs from different albums with this pickup. Unbelievably classic. I want one — now. I'm going to be ordering one this week.

Here's the kicker with the DSL-100, although they're meant to be turned up to a moderate or loud volume, I've always had to set the volume at 4, more typically at half, and the gain at 3 to get any kind of "classic" tone through the Green channel, crunch mode on - with the Gretsch's Powertron Plus bridge pickup.

Today, with his Dean, we set the master volume at 1-1.5, and gain at the same, and it still sounded amazing. No mud, total clarity, definition, thick, tight, biting mid range, low mid, and low end richness and growl or — spank for that matter, depending on how you set the amp. The top end was bright, articulated, yet controlled and muscled, no shrill. I just found the best pickup I think I've ever heard.

 

[Badmonkey]

i dont like the big pickguard

HeHasTheJazzHands is right but if to buy ltd
waiting for the ltd elite viper

 

[Rozman62]

Cool review. Provide a follow up when you get that SD cooking. Very interested in the outcome because I also have a DSL 100 with NOS preamp tubes. I've been thinking on eventually replacing the 490/498T pups. I have heard good things about the Dimarzio Air Zones so may run with that. I bought some PAF 36 anniv and put them in my LP and they are awesome. In '81 I had a Dean Z Explorer built for me through there custom shop in arctic white. It had super distortions in it and they were great. I sold the guitar in '83.

 

[paul-e-mann]

Thats a beautiful guitar. Most guitars wont feel or sound right until you have them setup to your liking, strings, action, intonation, relief, maybe oiling the fingerboard. All my guitars are setup the same, strings etc., I can switch between them all without hardly a notice.

 

[maltone]

Bad Monkey, I don't love it either, but up close, it's pretty bad ass. It's the way it plays. It plays itself — almost. Lots of neck to wrap your hand around, nothing feels crammed. I really dig it.

Roz - that DiMarzio DP100 - since you've already heard it once upon a time, and this is probably something you've heard many times, but..

Hear the intro riff ending on the trailing A chord? We go that sound, to the letter. [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-pR0MOJKZM]AC/DC Shoot to Thrill - YouTube[/ame] - that A chord trailing off... GEOWWW. I mean - exactly that tone. I'm even thinking he used a DP100 for parts of that album, it sounded too much like it.

I'm just so amazed at how the volume knob on the bridge pickup actually worked, I had to turn it down to 1 or 2 for it to lose treble, and even then, it wasn't really that bad at all. AMAZING pickup.

 

[Duffy49]

I recently put a nickel covered Dimarzio SuperDistortion in the bridge of an LP and I totally agree that it is not like its name suggests at all - it doesn't sound distorted at all and has lots of mid range, not a lot of treble bite like a Duncan JB, more mid range fullness but not muddy.

I think that the SuperDistortion would be a great choice for the SG and I might put one in mine.