How to use effects loop on new Marshall Amps?

[usablefiber]

I am looking to get some more effects for my rig. Previously I have used a very simple pre-amp pedal setup (Guitar-> 2 tube screamers -> wah pedal -> compressor -> amp). Occasionally a vibe or phaser pedal. I noticed my JCM 800 RI has an effects loop.

I was looking to get some delay, maybe a chorus pedal and maybe a flanger.

Where does the effects loop go into the signal? before or after the pre amp section?

Also does it automatically switch off when you disengage effects? What effects are ideal to use in the loop instead of pre amp? Are there some effects that are incompatible with the loop?

Thanks for any help.

 

[Ugly Duckling]

I am looking to get some more effects for my rig. Previously I have used a very simple pre-amp pedal setup (Guitar-> 2 tube screamers -> wah pedal -> compressor -> amp). Occasionally a vibe or phaser pedal. I noticed my JCM 800 RI has an effects loop.

I was looking to get some delay, maybe a chorus pedal and maybe a flanger.

Where does the effects loop go into the signal? before or after the pre amp section?

Also does it automatically switch off when you disengage effects? What effects are ideal to use in the loop instead of pre amp? Are there some effects that are incompatible with the loop?

Thanks for any help.

The loop in most amps is located between the preamp and power amp. The most common is after gain and tone stack, but before the master volume.

Delay and reverb sounds good in the loop.
The loop is also a good place to put some pedal to raise the volume for solos. Like a MXR Micro Amp for instance.

The pedals in the loop functions as normal: When you step on any of them they either engage or disengage. The sound passes through in the same way as if the where placed before the input. No difference.
(Some amps have a switchable loop so you can switch the entire loop in or out of the chain. EVH amps has this function I think.)

Distortion pedals normally doesn't sound good in the loop and they go before the input of the amp.

Some pedals can go both before the input and in the loop.
Chorus, phaser, noise gate etc..
Here you have to try and listen which way you like best.
Eddie Van Halen has his MXR Phase 90 before the amp I think but it can go in the loop also. Same thing for flangers.

With your set up I would run the effects the same way as you:
Guitar-> 2 tube screamers -> wah pedal -> compressor -> amp. (Not sure where in the order to put the compressor as I never use one!)

Then I would put delay chorus and flanger in the loop.
The order can be varied regarding how you want it to sound: Chorus or flanger after the delay gives you sweeping repeats which can be a really cool effect.

If you are thinking of a boost pedal in the loop I think it sounds best before the delay. In that way you get the delay trails trailing off when you disengage the boost after the solo. Just be careful when setting it up so you don't overload the input of the delay when you step on the boost!

 

[Coronado]

With my 800, I like to use a reverb and chorus in the loop (takes out the harsh noise that comes if you run it in the chain with your OD's). I also like to put the MXR 10 band eq in the loop. Some people put it in the loop, some run it in front of the amp. I actually like both, but find that if its in the loop, its much better for shaping tone, while on the ground I find it effective for adding gain. As Mr. Duckling said, I also like to use the loop for a little extra boost for solos. I adjust the volume on my MXR eq to be a bit higher, AND can adjust the EQ so my solos have a significant sound. That MXR is a pretty good pedal by the way - you can really do a lot with it.

You may want to try using the wah before your OD pedal (I've read that this is a better place for it). I believe I read a good rule of thumb was tone shaping effects go in the e loop, gain/OD/distortion go in front of the amp (of course there are exceptions I'm sure to this rule).

Best of luck to you! I was playing my 800 last night and I LOVE the way it sounds loud, but I also really like the sound at lower volumes (I know, call me crazy!). I have 2 Celestion V30's in my 4x12, and I just love the way those speakers sound, even at lower volumes.

Enjoy!

 

[tubes]

Hey usab,
A more normal configuration up front would be:
Guitar > wah > compressor > boost/distortion/fuzz.

This way you're letting your guitar be affected by your wah and compression and you are letting the boost/distortion effects interact with your amp.

And then digital effects would go in the loop. Also some analogue effects would normally be in the loop, e.g. tremelo, phaser.

I'm just saying what's normal practice - it's not law.

Meanwhile I note that some people do like to put boost in front of wah.

I have put boost in the loop sometimes too. This can be useful with some Marshalls, depending on what sound you're looking for.

 

[BobV]

Loops are generally used for time-based effects or modulation like reverb or delay. If you have a delay in front of the amp, then as the tails start to get quieter, they'll also get cleaner which might be weird. If you have reverb in front of the amp, it sounds much louder and muddier when you switch to the lead channel, but theoretically reverb sounds better in the loop after the distortion. It also depends on the amp and how loud you play. If you've got a single ended Champ with the distortion coming from the output tube, there's not much point in an effects loop.

On a far more practical issue, you might find some effects are quieter in the loop, for instance my DOD stomp-box chorus has a more objectionable hiss when used in the pedalboard as opposed to in the loop. I never use it anyway.

I'd be afraid to use a compressor in the effects loop because (1) it'll magnify any noise you've built up so far and (2) the output volume knob on the compressor might become even more finicky when you're asking it to do essentially what a master volume knob is doing.

 

[stillrockin]

sl5 : no fx loop
jcm1
jmp1 : the same pb

 

[Stringjunkie]

I found this a while back and used to post it when people asked this question. I like it ymmv..

Sorry for the screenshot but it is what it is. They go on to say this is just a guideline and not set in stone but I find it works for me.

 

[Micky]

Nice explanation, but it says nothing about an FX loop...

 

[duncan11]

I've always had my delays, chorus, univibe, reverb and pitch shifter in the loop. When I used a wah it was right after my guitar in front but I don't use a wah anymore. I didn't like the muddy boost it gave.

I'm gonna have to get a Bad Cat unleash so I can enjoy my JCM1 more. (it'll add a loop in addition to boosting the output) The lack of a loop really kills it for me (another reason why I don't have an SL5). 95% of my effects require a loop.

 

[dptone5]

With my 800, I like to use a reverb and chorus in the loop (takes out the harsh noise that comes if you run it in the chain with your OD's). I also like to put the MXR 10 band eq in the loop. Some people put it in the loop, some run it in front of the amp. I actually like both, but find that if its in the loop, its much better for shaping tone, while on the ground I find it effective for adding gain. As Mr. Duckling said, I also like to use the loop for a little extra boost for solos. I adjust the volume on my MXR eq to be a bit higher, AND can adjust the EQ so my solos have a significant sound. That MXR is a pretty good pedal by the way - you can really do a lot with it.

You may want to try using the wah before your OD pedal (I've read that this is a better place for it). I believe I read a good rule of thumb was tone shaping effects go in the e loop, gain/OD/distortion go in front of the amp (of course there are exceptions I'm sure to this rule).

Best of luck to you! I was playing my 800 last night and I LOVE the way it sounds loud, but I also really like the sound at lower volumes (I know, call me crazy!). I have 2 Celestion V30's in my 4x12, and I just love the way those speakers sound, even at lower volumes.

Enjoy!

Coronado and I use are doing this exactly the same way. I use two cabs, one with greenbacks and the other with well worn G12T-75's. My JCM 800 Reissue is my go-to low volume amp. I love the way it sounds at low volume. And crank it, it is amazing. Right now, it is my overall favorite head I own and I just love the tone!!

In the loop, I use a Boss Chorus, MXR Carbon Copy, Mr. Springgy Reverb and a Monte Allums modded Boss GE-7 for tone shaping or volume boost. The Reissue's (2203X and 1987XL) have really nice FX loops (quiet and virtually no impact on tone).

DP

 

[Stringjunkie]

Nice explanation, but it says nothing about an FX loop...

Duh! I guess you're right. But I like my tuner, OD and wah out front. Everything else in my loop.

 

[MonstersOfTheMidway]

I am looking to get some more effects for my rig. Previously I have used a very simple pre-amp pedal setup (Guitar-> 2 tube screamers -> wah pedal -> compressor -> amp). Occasionally a vibe or phaser pedal. I noticed my JCM 800 RI has an effects loop.

I was looking to get some delay, maybe a chorus pedal and maybe a flanger.

Where does the effects loop go into the signal? before or after the pre amp section?

Also does it automatically switch off when you disengage effects? What effects are ideal to use in the loop instead of pre amp? Are there some effects that are incompatible with the loop?

Thanks for any help.

A JCM 800 model 2203 (model # I can only assume since you didn't specify) would have an effects loop that is designed in the circuit to lie between the preamp section and the power amp section. This particular effects loop also has a bypass switch so that the loop can be taken out of the circuit, but unfortunately Marshall did not create an option to make bypass a footswitchable feature (unless there is an aftermarket unit that will somehow allow you to do this). But as far as I know, if you want to take the effects loop out of the circuit,you gotta reach behind and push the switch (this is not a problem between songs, for example, but can be a problem if you need to make the switch mid song, such as adding the loop for a solo and then taking it out at the end of the solo.

Anyways, where you place your effects is up to you. All I can tell you is that is that some effects have a more profound when placed in the loop. Delays, in particular, are more profound in the loop than when placed before the preamp (i.e. before the amp's main input). Some effects, like delays, can be distorted by the preamp so much that they loose most of their effectiveness, yet this also depends a lot on the amp settings among other things. Still, the the basic idea with the effects loop is that when you use the effects in the loop, you are processing the distorted sound; if you put some of the more sensitive effects before the amp, you can potentially distort the processed sound (again, you can get some nice sounds with a delay or other modulation effects placed before the amp, but the more gain you use, the more you lessen the effectiveness of these kinds of effects.

I usually put delays and modulation effects in the loop. I sometimes use a Morley wah that is sounds pretty good infront or in the loop. I mostly use a multi-effects unit with built-in wah that is almost completely digital, and it sounds amazing in the loop.