Opinions on Celestion G12M-70

[rensklaassen]

Hey everyone... I've been gone for about 6 months, but I need your helpfull knowledge once again!

This sunday I'm going to check a '88 JCM800 2x12 cab.. it has G12M-70 speakers in them. Now I see a LOT of terrible reviews about these. Many people say they're the worst Celestions ever made.

Can you guys give me some opinions about them? And please don't just say: These suck ass, or: These kick ass.. I want to know WHY they suck ass/kick ass. Maybe some reasonable comparisons with other Celestions like the G12T0-75's/V30's/Greenbacks (and go on....) could be helpfull to!

Thank you guys!

 

[Susihukkanen]

I just bought one, but I haven't yet tested it. Based on this clip I liked it (G12M-70 is at 15:07-):

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=skfVh5qagoo&index=3&list=TL8SQYwj4c_liM9X0MPsXRyRpuAw9fP70V]27 Celestion Guitar Speakers Comparison - Shootout - YouTube[/ame]

 

[rensklaassen]

Cool video man, Thanks! Gotta remember this vid...
Must say that the g12M-70 sounds pretty edgy to me, I'm really curious on how they'll sound on my JVM... any more opinions people?

 

[Joshabr1]

Most people agree they are one of the worst speakers celestion ever produced. I personally think they are very stiff sounding and to scooped. Let your ears be the guide.

 

[GIBSON67]

I had a pair mixed with T75's and I thought they mixed really well. The M70's have a fairly flat response, not heavy in bass, highs somewhat neutral and lack luster mids. I liked them better than G12L35's, G12K85's or the G12H100's. But I liked the G12T75's better as well as GBs, 65's, V30's etc...I don't think they are as bad as everyone says but I did kept looking and trying other speakers so they weren't my favs either.

 

[vinceB]

I have heard they are happier in a closed cabinet. My 4210 had one and I didn't hate it but I ran a V30 in it's place for a while and now it has CL80. It is no where near as good as those. It reminds me of something a Crate might have. It'll do but it's not going to be great.

 

[jcm800gridlock]

I replaced the original G12M-70s in a Marshall JCM800 combo with vintage G12-65's. The G12-65's were an improvement, warmer and smoother OD. Sold the amp but kept the G12-65's.

 

[dreyn77]

But from another perspective they are the correct speaker for the 800 amp design.

There are many techniques for making the sound we call 'tone'.

the 70 speakers are designed for making clear acurite sound. then you adjust your guitar's dials and you get the tone you like and the volume you like.
The 800 design allowed guys to turn the amp down so the speaker needed to be redesigned to match the amp and if you turn the greenback down it looses some treble frequencies.
So you want the bright clear sound at low power settings. the 70's do that sound better than other speakers.

The whole point of the 800 was that the pedal was built into the amp and the reason for that was so guys could turn the vol down and get the distortion sound.

but you need to learn the original sound is bright clear and full treble. there's NO bass, there's NO mids whatever.
All that is, is just sonic illusion.

guys kept plugging the pedals into the 800 so they built that into the 900 amp design.
then guys kept plugging in pedals into the 900 so they added that idea into the DSL.
then guys were plugging pedals into the DSL so they made the JVM.
it's no wonder the JVM is super dooper bright. but guys don't run it the correct way, they don't have the EQ dials on 10 and use the quarter pound pickup design.
Finally guys are turning the dials down. it's taken many years for guys to learn to turn the dials down for tone and volume.

SO the original sound is a 15 watt valve amp into greenback speakers, but some idiot convinced the marshall experts he wanted to spend more money and loose some hearing so they made the JTM/JMP and the madness began...

It's all mad sound illusion.

It makes sense if you buy the original or you buy the exact gear of the bloke who made the vinyl record/live show sound version.

If your chaseing CD/MP3/YOUTUBE sound forget it! it doesn't exist

 

[stilllifer]

I had 2 in an X pattern with Greenbacks in my 4x12 and I thought they paired well with the Greenbacks. I didn't really like them on their own so much (very flat sounding) but blended with the crunch of the Greenbacks they seemed to pair well.

 

[soundboy57]

Just bite the bullet and admit they sound like ass.
All the negative reviews are correct.
Worst speaker Celestion ever made. Period.
Thin, edgy....irritating, and
hard to sell.

Pass on the cab unless it is dirt cheap, mint, and you plan on swapping speakers.

My two cents.

 

[stilllifer]

Just bite the bullet and admit they sound like ass.
All the negative reviews are correct.
Worst speaker Celestion ever made. Period.
Thin, edgy....irritating, and
hard to sell.

Pass on the cab unless it is dirt cheap, mint, and you plan on swapping speakers.

My two cents.

Very true. While I admit they sounded OK in a mix with Greenbacks, I would never buy a cab loaded with them, unless I was going to swap them out pronto!

 

[rensklaassen]

For those who may be interested...
I've been testing the cabinet yesterday with my JVM.
First thought was that the speakers weren't balanced that good.. So I've been tweaking my JVM (mostly turning the mids up) and I thought it was OK. \
People tell nothing but bad news on these speakers, even 'The History of Marshall' book describes them as 'probably the least popular speakers in the Marshall history'.. Once I've tweaked my amp I thought they were very very punchy.. way tighter than my 1960AV with 4x vintage 30's in them.. Can you inmagine? But what would be the difference from g12 65's and 75's? Is it truly a very different speaker(technically, specification wise)??? Has it a different magnet or cone or something? Why could it be that this speaker would be so much worse compared to other speakers from that era... I think there indeed are way better speakers but that the hate is 'maybe a little bit' hyped and that 50% of the internethero's never even tried them.. At least Marshallforum has been a quite fair and honest forum to me... So I still want more opinions and technical specs!!!!

 

[Australian]

Hey everyone... I've been gone for about 6 months, but I need your helpfull knowledge once again!

This sunday I'm going to check a '88 JCM800 2x12 cab.. it has G12M-70 speakers in them. Now I see a LOT of terrible reviews about these. Many people say they're the worst Celestions ever made.

Can you guys give me some opinions about them? And please don't just say: These suck ass, or: These kick ass.. I want to know WHY they suck ass/kick ass. Maybe some reasonable comparisons with other Celestions like the G12T0-75's/V30's/Greenbacks (and go on....) could be helpfull to!

Thank you guys!

What style of music do you play, and what sort of tone do you want to achieve?

I've tried many speakers with the JVM. And whether its Greenbacks, V30's, 65's, G12H30's or 75's they all sound good. The difference is that particular channels will sound even better with particular speakers.

I personally think that Santiago was spot on with the V30 and Heritage speaker that he put in the JVM combos.
Every channel shines with these speakers.

And the bad reviews on the 70's are unjustified. They aren't that bad. If you like the sound, then keep them.

 

[rensklaassen]

What style of music do you play, and what sort of tone do you want to achieve?

I've tried many speakers with the JVM. And whether its Greenbacks, V30's, 65's, G12H30's or 75's they all sound good. The difference is that particular channels will sound even better with particular speakers.

I personally think that Santiago was spot on with the V30 and Heritage speaker that he put in the JVM combos.
Every channel shines with these speakers.

And the bad reviews on the 70's are unjustified. They aren't that bad. If you like the sound, then keep them.

Well I play lead guitar in a band with 3 guitarists. We play the 70/80's hard/classic/bluesrock and the heavy/glam metal.. so with some extra mids, I'm blending pretty good trough the bands mix for a guitar solo... the high sounds are very directley and punchy on my OD-2 channel!

 

[vinceB]

But what would be the difference from g12 65's and 75's? Is it truly a very different speaker(technically, specification wise)???

I'm confused. You first stated they were G12 70 then later 75. There is a difference as the 75 is held in slightly higher regard as opposed the "worst speaker" they ever made.

 

[chuckharmonjr]

I have a coupla my cabinets with 70's paired with 70-80's. If you sum the curves from those two you get a perfect flat line. The result is a cabinet which faithfully reproduces what the head is putting out frequency wise with no coloration from the speakers. Actually, I like that kinda hi-fi approach.

 

[Ken]

I have a coupla my cabinets with 70's paired with 70-80's. If you sum the curves from those two you get a perfect flat line. The result is a cabinet which faithfully reproduces what the head is putting out frequency wise with no coloration from the speakers. Actually, I like that kinda hi-fi approach.

My G12H-80's are like that too. Very flat response. I like how I can scoop the mids for death metal or punch them up for AC/DC using the EQ and both sound great. Very versatile, and LOUD cabinets. Heavy too...

Ken

 

[Salsg]

I like the 70 much more than the 75.

 

[rensklaassen]

I'm confused. You first stated they were G12 70 then later 75. There is a difference as the 75 is held in slightly higher regard as opposed the "worst speaker" they ever made.

I'm sorry, I meant the 70's in stead of 75's.
I do think they work out good for me since we have 3 guitarists and a bass player.. there's a large amount of bass tones in our band and as the lead guitarist I think the the agressive high's from the 70's come in handy in our band...

 

[soundboy57]

I have a coupla my cabinets with 70's paired with 70-80's. If you sum the curves from those two you get a perfect flat line. The result is a cabinet which faithfully reproduces what the head is putting out frequency wise with no coloration from the speakers. Actually, I like that kinda hi-fi approach.

SInce Celestion changed up the late 70's blackbacks, and there was also about 40 versions of slightly different G12 65's from what I have read...perhaps
the same is true of the G12 70's....some may sound better than others, hence the difference of opinion.

I have only rarely heard or played them, didn't care for them...but it has been long while....that is just me, and if someone likes them, I get that, too...no problem...

If the ones you have sound good with your setup, then rock on!!

Just the slightest change in voice coil former, cone weight, suspension stiffness, etc, can make a huge difference for better or worse.

The difference between 80s to early 90's G12 75's (more balls, less fizziness), and later model ones from say the last 10 years, is HUGE. And the clips I have heard support this.

The old ones can sound killer in a 2x12 or 4x12