Preamp tubes really do change the sound **noob here lol

[Vegas strip]

Raytheon long balck plate are excellent tubes. V1 will be your biggest tonal change.

I know I have a Raytheon in the closet. I still need to learn about the "plate" short vs long etc. No idea what does what.

 

[nortiks]

I still need to learn about the "plate" short vs long etc. No idea what does what.

Its just a way to visually identify the different designs a manufacturer used over the years for the same part number. Same for plate color. They all sound a bit different since they are in fact different tubes. If the number has a different suffix (e.g. 12AX7-A vs 12AX7-WA) they are somewhat different spec wise (even if they look identical), but in most applications are compatible.

 

[Pete Farrington]

Regardless of the branding / manufacturer of a valve, a dodgy or worn out valve sounds worse than a good valve.

A bad JJ doesn’t mean that all JJ are bad.

There’s gazillions more bad or failing holy grail valves than there are good ones still remaining.

 

[Vegas strip]

Its just a way to visually identify the different designs a manufacturer used over the years for the same part number. Same for plate color. They all sound a bit different since they are in fact different tubes. If the number has a different suffix (e.g. 12AX7-A vs 12AX7-WA) they are somewhat different spec wise (even if they look identical), but in most applications are compatible.

Ok, I was thinking long vs short was reference to the contact pins lol. Just shows how much I know .

 

[Vegas strip]

Regardless of the branding / manufacturer of a valve, a dodgy or worn out valve sounds worse than a good valve.

A bad JJ doesn’t mean that all JJ are bad.

There’s gazillions more bad or failing holy grail valves than there are good ones still remaining.

Thanks for the tips. Stuff happens and I get it and I'm lucky to have this non branded tube.

 

[Pete Farrington]

Thanks for the tips.

As you’re new to valve amps, you may benefit from this info that I’ve posted previously -

SOP for valve amp users with concerns about their amp’s performance / behaviour is to eliminate there being a failing / failed valve.

A ‘known good’ spare or 2 of each valve type in their amp is required. And preferably a whole spare set of output valves, that preferably all pass similar idle anode or cathode current, and which are reasonably close to the valves the amp is set up (biased) for, if the amp is fixed bias.

When problems emerge, swap a good spare valve into each socket in turn. If the spare doesn’t help with the issue, refit the previous valve and move along to the next socket.

When initially checking unknown or suspect output or rectifier valves in an amp, it’s beneficial to power the amp via a light bulb limiter. The wattage of the bulb used should be about twice that of the amp’s rated power output (eg so around a 100W bulb for a 50W ish amp). As otherwise, if the new / unknown valves short, they may stress and damage the amp.

 

[Vegas strip]

So I was wrong all along about that unbranded tube lol. Reason being it's hard to even see the print without light and it's a Sovtek 7025.

 

[Vegas strip]

I'm not surprised, JJs are known for being "dark" sounding. I like JJs ok, but not for V1.

After coming back to review some of the comments and swapping the V1 for a Conn tube, I have to agree with your statement with JJ sound dark. Even the Ecc82 Conn is somewhat dark sounding and tomorrow I'm going to throw Solvtek to wake it up.

 

[Vegas strip]

I received my new tubes today and swapped the V1 Solvtek Ecc83 to a Conn Ecc82 and it's definitely darker sounding like JJ but I have to crank the amp as I wasn't expecting the Ecc82 to drop that much gain lol. Really cool that preamp tube can change the gain stage especially if you have hot pickups.

Think I'm going to build a preamp tube collection lol.

 

[Jethro Rocker]

I received my new tubes today and swapped the V1 Solvtek Ecc83 to a Conn Ecc82 and it's definitely darker sounding like JJ but I have to crank the amp as I wasn't expecting the Ecc82 to drop that much gain lol. Really cool that preamp tube can change the gain stage especially if you have hot pickups.

Think I'm going to build a preamp tube collection lol.

It changes the gain because different types of tubes have different sensitivity, often called gain factor but not entirely true.
ECC83 (12AX7) has 100% "gain factor" where a 12 AU7 is like 19%.
One can put a lower value tube in the PI which drops the volume allowing you to turn up the amp more if it has a really sensitive volume control.

 

[Vegas strip]

It changes the gain because different types of tubes have different sensitivity, often called gain factor but not entirely true.
ECC83 (12AX7) has 100% "gain factor" where a 12 AU7 is like 19%.
One can put a lower value tube in the PI which drops the volume allowing you to turn up the amp more if it has a really sensitive volume control.

Right on man. Thanks for the lesson and I'm stoked about trying new tubes and it's way easier than messing with guitar pickups.

 

[Vegas strip]

Guys, I put the Sovtek in the V1 and Conn in V2 and sheeeesh it's almost perfect. Squishy but not too squishy and Sovtek really give it a slight more kick without needing to pick harder.

I wonder if any Black Friday sales going on for tubes because a buddy of mine who knew Jimmy Pages tech had recommended Tungsol and I think I might try em. It's freaking cool just swapping tubes can give a new tonal character.

 

[Jethro Rocker]

Guys, I put the Sovtek in the V1 and Conn in V2 and sheeeesh it's almost perfect. Squishy but not too squishy and Sovtek really give it a slight more kick without needing to pick harder.

I wonder if any Black Friday sales going on for tubes because a buddy of mine who knew Jimmy Pages tech had recommended Tungsol and I think I might try em. It's freaking cool just swapping tubes can give a new tonal character.

I have found Tungsol not very robust in the PI position, as in, I had 2 die very quickly there in 2 different amps. Just FYI.
I had troubles in V1 slot

 

[Vegas strip]

W

I have found Tungsol not very robust in the PI position, as in, I had 2 die very quickly there in 2 different amps. Just FYI.
I had troubles in V1 slot

Maybe I can check Amazon and if it fail I'll send it back.

 

[Jethro Rocker]

W

Maybe I can check Amazon and if it fail I'll send it back.

Just don't use in that position, IMO. I doubt anywhere will take back dead tubes

 

[EndGame00]

You can also notice the "feel" change with tube swap. Some tubes feel stiff, others feel squishy when you play.

 

[Dirty Harry]

I have found Tungsol not very robust in the PI position, as in, I had 2 die very quickly there in 2 different amps. Just FYI.
I had troubles in V1 slot

I’ve also had a couple of TS die prematurely in V1 in the last 12 mths or so, so I’ve gone off them. Shame as they do sound great…

 

[solarburn]

Guys, I put the Sovtek in the V1 and Conn in V2 and sheeeesh it's almost perfect. Squishy but not too squishy and Sovtek really give it a slight more kick without needing to pick harder.

I wonder if any Black Friday sales going on for tubes because a buddy of mine who knew Jimmy Pages tech had recommended Tungsol and I think I might try em. It's freaking cool just swapping tubes can give a new tonal character.

Just a suggestion, while you're using a 7025 in V1, try a EH 7025 version/brand. I settled on the EH 7025's for both my 5150's. Low noise floor/microphony yet plenty of zest. Do well whatever amp(SC800-ORI50-5150-PLEXI)I've put them in. Usually just V1 or V1/V2. Definitely notice less background hiss compared to a few of my other favs. Dig em.

Tubes are subtle at best though. When you're done piddling around, speakers are where the real shit happens. And stripperz. Spendy but hey, R&R has to be inspiring and gratifying.

 

[Jethro Rocker]

Just a suggestion, while you're using a 7025 in V1, try a EH 7025 version/brand. I settled on the EH 7025's for both my 5150's. Low noise floor/microphony yet plenty of zest. Do well whatever amp(SC800-ORI50-5150-PLEXI)I've put them in. Usually just V1 or V1/V2. Definitely notice less background hiss compared to a few of my other favs. Dig em.

Tubes are subtle at best though. When you're done piddling around, speakers are where the real shit happens. And stripperz. Spendy but hey, R&R has to be inspiring and gratifying.

Absolutely! It is subtle compared to other changes one can make.

 

[What?]

I have found Tungsol not very robust in the PI position, as in, I had 2 die very quickly there in 2 different amps. Just FYI.
I had troubles in V1 slot

I’ve also had a couple of TS die prematurely in V1 in the last 12 mths or so, so I’ve gone off them. Shame as they do sound great…

Thirded on tung sols dying early. It's commonly said not to use them for the cathode follower, but I just haven't seen good life from them in general. I also haven't heard anything particularly special from them over other tubes.

Tubes are subtle at best though. When you're done piddling around, speakers are where the real shit happens.

Agreed. I feel like tubes are something to tinker with after everything else is pretty well settled, and you're looking to corksniff a bit more. This is assuming that the tubes in the amp are healthy to begin with. If not, yea, replace them ASAP.