strings that feel too stiff and rigid

[GibsonMarshallGuy47]

Not sure if you stated this somewhere, but have you just stepped up to a wound 3rd string, or is it your usual go-to for the 'G'.

I seem to remember briefly trying a set with a wound 3rd (or just got one single) years ago and hated it.
The wound 3rd was really stiff compared to a plain 3rd equivalent.
Is that what is throwing off the feel of the whole set?

D'Addario do make a 12-54 set with a plain 3rd (20p) you could try, or just swap in a single 20p.

12-54 Heavy Plain Third, XL Nickel Wound Electric Guitar Strings | EXL145 | D'Addario

Our best-belling electric set, XL Nickel has been revered by players everywhere since 1974. This 12-54 Heavy gauge set is made with a plain steel 3rd/G-string for more flexibility than traditional 12-gauge electric strings. Learn more.

www.daddario.com

I've ALWAYS used strings with a wound third... been doing that for the past 15 years or so. I hate plain third strings. and yes, I do normally use D'Addario strings like 70 to 80% of the time. although recently I've switched to Dunlop.

 

[57kaye]

Have you tried top wrapping the strings ala Duane Allman..this can often make the strings seem slacker.Give it a try it may help some and it's free.☺

 

[JSJ900]

I tried top wrapping the strings before, and I hated it. it made no difference in the sound and feel of my playing, and I actually felt like I was possibly doing damage to the body of the guitar. I'll never do that again.

I could see how someone may be concerned trying with a hollow-body, but w/ a solid-body SG or LP?

For me the strings seem less stiff and I also like the smaller break angle at the saddle - makes if more comfortable muting strings with picking hand.

This argument was been done to death though. Either people like it or they don’t. Might be an easy fix to the OP’s problem.

 

[Purgasound]

I was going to second top wrapping. If you're opposed to actually top wrapping you can achieve pretty much the same effect by raising the tail piece and lessening the break angle from the bridge saddles to the tail piece. The sharper break angle ads increased tension between the saddle and tailpiece. That can be relieved by reducing The break angle. The result is easier bending. On its face, even if you don't bend it will still feel slightly different just fretting strings.
Another thing that can make guitars feel like they're working against you is dirty or rough frets. If the frets are polished and smooth it will give a much better feel. This is more apparent when doing a lot of bending and vibrato but it will make a difference even if you don't do it. Depending on the grip of the player there is always some sliding against the frets and any added friction is going to be working against you.
Of course action can be adjusted but that's pretty easy to wrap your head around.
Other than that it's pretty much going to a lighter gauge.

 

[ElvisNixon]

I agree with @Purgasound about raising the stop tailpiece to reduce break angle. Depending on your particular SG, sometimes the joint of the neck to the body can be a weak point. I think reducing the tension would be a good thing for your SG’s long term health too. If the tailpiece is decked now, you should be able to reduce the tension and feel a good deal more than anything to do with the trussrod.

 

[fitz]

I actually felt like I was possibly doing damage to the body of the guitar. I'll never do that again.

I ground the stop bar and top wrap all my Gibbies (except the SG with a Bigsby).
How's it going to damage the body?

 

[DirtySteve]

I was going to suggest top wrapping also until I read post #20. I always top wrap and always have, I've never had any damage.

 

[jsadctnfn1]

I was going to suggest top wrapping also until I read post #20. I always top wrap and always have, I've never had any damage.

Just curious. I'm not the OP, but... do you take up space in the tailpiece, for the end wrap of your strings, by using the ball end of old strings? If not, what are you using? Thanks

 

[Tederoni]

I have a Gibson SG that I have set up for heavier strings. I currently play in C standard tuning, and I'm using a set of Nickel Wound strings that are .012-.054 (with a wound third string)... (I was previously using a .011-.052 set , so its not like I'm going much heavier). however, I've noticed over the past few months that the strings feel very rigid and stiff. and its not because the strings are old, because they've felt like this since I put a new set of strings on.

I'm an experienced player, but I am somewhat of a novice when it comes to setting up my guitar for heavier strings. however, I do understand how to adjust the truss rod, and I know about making sure the nut slots are properly notched to accommodate heavier gauge strings, as well as making sure the tailpiece, bridge, and pickups are set at the right height... what can I do to get the strings to resonate better and to not feel so tight and rigid? what adjustments can I or should I be making? maybe the truss rod needs to be adjusted further, I don't know. its been a few years since I've taken it to a professional to have a set-up done. I know I should probably bring it in to have it taken care of by a luthier, but I'd like to see if I can take care of this issue on my own.

and just to clarify - aside from a truss rod wrench, and a cheap multi-slotting tool for the nut, I really don't have any legit luthier tools to make any precise measurements. I was just hoping I can make a few minor adjustments to get the strings to feel looser and resonate and sustain better. can anyone give me any tips?

Raise the tailpiece until the strings rattle just a bit and then tighten it back down a little until it stops rattling. You can get a real slinky feeling that way. Otherwise, maybe find 11.5 gauge set with something like a 50 on the bottom.

 

[december]

A 54 tuned to C will be the same tension no matter how the guitar is set up. If the action is too high, it'll be harder to play, but lowering it won't change the string tension. The only way to reduce tension is to shorten the scale length or use lighter gauges, or strings with less tension... not every 54 has the same tension. The material and way it's made influences the tension. Round core has less tension than hex core. Stainless steel has less tension than nickel-plated steel. D'Addario NPS has less tension than Stringjoy NPS... Stringjoy and D'Addario have tension calculators.
If you don't want lighter strings, try round core, stainless steel, or D'Addario.

 

[PelliX]

I ground the stop bar and top wrap all my Gibbies (except the SG with a Bigsby).
How's it going to damage the body?

I'm going to hazard a guess that he means there might some scratching when swapping strings. Given the confusion on display, I'd recommend OP to reach out to someone locally who know what he's doing and get some advice, perhaps have them set up the guitar and observe the process.

 

[PrestonCowboy]

From a purely mechanical engineering basis, going from 11 to 12 is a bigger jump than you'd imagine - the stiffness of something goes up by the CUBE power of the depth (diameter in this case). So that's really 30% increase for just the plain wire when not tensioned.

And as per others the tension has to increased vs a thinner string, to get the same note. So that doubles down on it. Whereas the down-tuning will have much less of an effect.

 

[dro]

The stiffness of the string is determined by the tension. The truss rod does not determine the tension of the strings; the tuners do.

The truss rod will not immediately affect the string tension per say.
What it can do, is bring the center of the neck a bit straighter. Ever so slightly. Causing you to have to push the string less, to make contact with the frets. (IN THE CENTER OF THE NECK ONLY)
This of course is assuming that the guitar setup is good to begin with.
You mention an SG. I have not bought any guitar in the past, regardless of brand, or quality. That does not require some fine tuning.
In my old age, I like Gibson Custom shop guitars the best. But even those high dollar guitars, need a little love.
The biggest issue is the nut. If you don't have the nut files, or don't want to get into it.
Take it to a "trusted" (operative word here) luthier/tech. Ask about which type of tuner they use as a calibration instrument.
If they do not use a Peterson or Conn strobe. This would be a red flag for me. A "professional" tech will use professional quality tools.
Be sure to tell the tech, you want the first fret note, to fret a true half step. If the nut is high, even by a few thousandths of an inch. You will have a farther distance to travel. Thereby stretching the string more, than say, your other guitar.
This has been my main complaint with all guitars. Electric, acoustic, Gibson, Fender, PRS, Gibson Acoustic, Martin, Taylor, it doesn't matter.
The nut is high on all of them, out of the box. And a cheaper tuner may not measure this.
The bridge on the other hand is pretty self-explanatory. Want it lower? Lower the bridge. Want it higher? Raise the bridge. Easy peasy.
SG's after a certain year. I think 2005 or so, have all been Pleked at the factory. So, you are not likely to find a high fret.
Truss rod tension should be checked every time you change strings.
You can do this without feeler gagues. Just press the first and last fret. There should be the slightest gap in the middle of the neck, between the string and the 7th-8th fret. Tap the string if it just barely bounces, you are good. If no bounce. Your truss rod is too tight. An vice versa.
I could give you the measurements that I use. But if you have no tools it would be of no use.
Good luck.

 

[DirtySteve]

Just curious. I'm not the OP, but... do you take up space in the tailpiece, for the end wrap of your strings, by using the ball end of old strings? If not, what are you using? Thanks

I do, but I didn't always. I don't think it matters really.

 

[yafal]

H

I have a Gibson SG that I have set up for heavier strings. I currently play in C standard tuning, and I'm using a set of Nickel Wound strings that are .012-.054 (with a wound third string)... (I was previously using a .011-.052 set , so its not like I'm going much heavier). however, I've noticed over the past few months that the strings feel very rigid and stiff. and its not because the strings are old, because they've felt like this since I put a new set of strings on.

I'm an experienced player, but I am somewhat of a novice when it comes to setting up my guitar for heavier strings. however, I do understand how to adjust the truss rod, and I know about making sure the nut slots are properly notched to accommodate heavier gauge strings, as well as making sure the tailpiece, bridge, and pickups are set at the right height... what can I do to get the strings to resonate better and to not feel so tight and rigid? what adjustments can I or should I be making? maybe the truss rod needs to be adjusted further, I don't know. its been a few years since I've taken it to a professional to have a set-up done. I know I should probably bring it in to have it taken care of by a luthier, but I'd like to see if I can take care of this issue on my own.

and just to clarify - aside from a truss rod wrench, and a cheap multi-slotting tool for the nut, I really don't have any legit luthier tools to make any precise measurements. I was just hoping I can make a few minor adjustments to get the strings to feel looser and resonate and sustain better. can anyone give me any tips?

Hi, in my experience you just can't compensate the feel of heavy strings adjusting the settings of the guitar. I tune to drop C, short scale (Gibson flying V) and .011 is the gauge I feel the best. It doesn't respond too well up the neck, say like .010, but holds the tuning and sounds thick and very good for hard rock and metal (though not for R'n'R). Definetely for me it was not a good idea to use a wound third string... I tried it, same as you do ( .012) but it was a no no.
Just my experience.
Cheers.

 

[GibsonMarshallGuy47]

as a slight detour to this thread...

I am thinking about possibly upgrading the nut for my other 2 older guitars (the one I just got recently already has a really good one), since they're just the stock plastic ones. but until then, I would like to get the proper nut slotting tool so that I can make some slight adjustments to my two older guitars for heavier gauge strings. I'm fairly certain I'm only going to need to adjust the slots to the 3 lower strings. my question is - considering the strings I'm going to be using (.054-.012 with a wound third) what affordable nut slot files should I be getting for this job? do I need multiple ones? if so, what exact sizes do I need to look for?

 

[december]

as a slight detour to this thread...

I am thinking about possibly upgrading the nut for my other 2 older guitars (the one I just got recently already has a really good one), since they're just the stock plastic ones. but until then, I would like to get the proper nut slotting tool so that I can make some slight adjustments to my two older guitars for heavier gauge strings. I'm fairly certain I'm only going to need to adjust the slots to the 3 lower strings. my question is - considering the strings I'm going to be using (.054-.012 with a wound third) what affordable nut slot files should I be getting for this job? do I need multiple ones? if so, what exact sizes do I need to look for?

The cheapest set I found is the Hosco. 3 files, 2 gauges each. They're 46 - 10, but I'm using them for up to 59 - 12 and they get the job done, you just gotta carefully use them to widen the slot without making it deeper sometimes. They were ~$50.