The most badass Marshall tone - JCM 800

[marshallmellowed]

IMO.

I've had 'em, I've gigged 'em, I now have an SC20H, looking for a 2203 locally, there is no other.

The only Marshall that not only shakes your balls and punches you in the chesticals, but also slaps you in the face. No other Marshall can do it like the JCM 800.

Couldn't agree more, my most played Marshall.

 

[marshallmellowed]

Yah you're preach'n to the choir!lol

Glorious Marshalls. It's tough being teased by the lil SC when what's best in the amp is the big Iron sound. Thumpa a lumpa doshus!!!



Good hunting Vin, hope you score a healthy one!

Merry Christmas!

Yep, the SC will get you to 2nd base, but then you'll have to date her older sister.

 

[67mike]

Yes the 2203 is a monster. Iconic for good reason.

The 2204 hangs right in there only 2-3 Db short of the max vol of 2203.

The 2555x with output master on 8 or above again hangs right in there.


So.....any of the above fights for top spot imho.

 

[Deftone]

YES! I always screw that up. I think I'm lisdexic. Or lesdixic. Something.

Man, if you were nearby I'd invite you over to sample and compare my different JCM800's with different speakers.

I was just playing the 2205...it's different. Definitely good, but it's got it's own thing going on. Sort of sounds like a cross between a JCM900DR and a single channel JCM800 2203/4.

 

[DreamerDeceiver]

 

[Vinsanitizer]

So the 2205 /2210 were the two channel 800 heads that came out right before the 900s debut ? Precursor to the jcm 900?

Yes, 2-channel, but the Silver Jubilee was the very last of the 800 models before the JCM 900's, and don't forget also, the Valvestate series.

 

[Vinsanitizer]

Man, if you were nearby I'd invite you over to sample and compare my different JCM800's with different speakers.

I was just playing the 2205...it's different. Definitely good, but it's got it's own thing going on. Sort of sounds like a cross between a JCM900DR and a single channel JCM800 2203/4.

There's something unique about the Presence in those 2-chan. models that I don't think I've ever heard on any record. My SC20H has it too, but slightly less obvious. If I ever come across an honest version of it on YT, I'll post it, but I don't hear it in any videos yet, because every video I see has a dopey guitar player using it in drop-D, or they have it doctored up or something.

 

[V-man]

Yes, 2-channel, but the Silver Jubilee was the very last of the 800 models before the JCM 900's, and don't forget also, the Valvestate series.

The SJ is not an 800.

It is its own series: JCM 25/50, being the first Marshall to switch from half power (triode) to full power mode (pentode).

As a Diode-driven amp with 2 footswitch “channels”, it has things in common with the 2205/10, but it is right as much a look back to the 1980s as it is a look forward to the 1990s, sharing as much IMO with a 900 MkIII or perhaps DR with its dark character and shared half-power modes, while being too far removed from either the 800 or 900 series, earning its distinct series designation.

 

[Vinsanitizer]

Actually, the first 800 model has the sound I'm talking about that my 2205/10's had. So hard to find any good videos. Don't pay attention to the gain and the overall crappy tone, listen to the upper mids. I can never find the right word for it, but it's kind of a "quack", and when you hear it in person it hits you in the face.

 

[Ronquest]

No, it's a little desk sign that reads, "I'm not bossy, I just know what you should be doing"

I know what my wife is getting for Christmas!

 

[Vinsanitizer]

The SJ is not an 800.

It is its own series: JCM 25/50, being the first Marshall to switch from half power (triode) to full power mode (pentode).

As a Diode-driven amp with 2 footswitch “channels”, it has things in common with the 2205/10, but it is right as much a look back to the 1980s as it is a look forward to the 1990s, sharing as much IMO with a 900 MkIII or perhaps DR with its dark character and shared half-power modes, while being too far removed from either the 800 or 900 series, earning its distinct series designation.

Are you sure? They weren't advertised as an 800, but according to what I was told, they used similar circuits and were the last of the 800 series, and the 900 was a whole new design. Otherwise, I know nothing about them except they were the last models before the 900. I never had one, and never had a 900 either. The word on the street when the 900's came out, is that they crap, and that Marshall "still" weren't listening to their customers.

 

[svinyard]

She doesn’t need a second one as I’m pretty sure all wives are given one of those on the day they are born.

I know what my wife is getting for Christmas!

 

[V-man]

Are you sure? They weren't advertised as an 800, but according to what I was told, they used similar circuits and were the last of the 800 series, and the 900 was a whole new design. Otherwise, I know nothing about them except they were the last models before the 900. I never had one, and never had a 900 either. The word on the street when the 900's came out, is that they crap, and that Marshall "still" weren't listening to their customers.

After owning an ‘89 2550, I’d say I’m slightly confident.


People are told many interesting things.

When I hear 80’s Scorpions, Testament, and RATM, (a few notable uses of 2205/10s) I don’t hear Jubilees.

Hardly an expert on switching-800s but I have not perceived them to be dark. SJs in particular and 900s OTOH have been considered such.

And while there was fuckery going on with both 800s (channel bleed) and 25/50s (pseudo-channel switcher), the ”channels” of one-another seem to operate in completely distinct ways with the MkIII‘s evolution both stabilizing the 2205/10 format into a “proper“ and problem-free 2-channel amp, while adding diode options to the channel (or out of it) reminiscent of the SJ’s rhythm clip.

 

[Vinsanitizer]

View attachment 142314

After owning an ‘89 2550, I’d say I’m slightly confident.


People are told many interesting things.

When I hear 80’s Scorpions, Testament, and RATM, (a few notable uses of 2205/10s) I don’t hear Jubilees.

Hardly an expert on switching-800s but I have not perceived them to be dark. SJs in particular and 900s OTOH have been considered such.

And while there was fuckery going on with both 800s (channel bleed) and 25/50s (pseudo-channel switcher), the ”channels” of one-another seem to operate in completely distinct ways with the MkIII‘s evolution both stabilizing the 2205/10 format into a “proper“ and problem-free 2-channel amp, while adding diode options to the channel (or out of it) reminiscent of the SJ’s rhythm clip.

I never experienced any channel bleed problems with my 2205/10, and still don't know what that sounds like, but I never used the Normal channel, it sounded pretty dull to me. Apparently, both of mine had diode clipping. I couldn't have cared less, they just sounded great and I was happy with that. I have about zero knowledge about amp tech stuff. I can change the tubes and that's about it.

Can you give me a generalization of the difference in sound between the 800 series and the SJ? I always thought they were an 800 with switching options and a few tone tweaks. I think about getting a mini SJ, but I have yet to try one. The price is pretty steep now.

 

[V-man]

I never experienced and channel bleed problems with my 2205/10, and still don't know what that sounds like, but I never used the Normal channel, it sounded pretty dull to me. Apparently, both of mine had diode clipping. I couldn't have cared less, they just sounded great and I was happy with that. I have about zero knowledge about amp tech stuff. I can change the tubes and that's about it.

Can you give me a generalization of the difference in sound between the 800 series and the SJ? I always thought they were an 800 with switching options and a few tone tweaks. I think about getting a mini SJ, but I have yet to try one. The price is pretty steep now.

Understanding that “Marshall” has a generalized mid-focused voice from Plexi to DSL and the differences therein are subtle but perceptible.

2203: Bright as fuck. Out of a band setting, people like to keep either P and/or T low, otherwise you could practically break off the EQ knobs for what little difference they make. The distortion is “raw, open, aggressive” and “unfocused.” Outside of 70s rock, it benefits from (requires) a boost to compress/cut increasing lows and add drive, which blends seamlessly to its base tone, whether transparent or not. In addition to taking every “decent“ or above drive pedal effortlessly, it can sound great through a crazy selection of speakers. The clean tones are surprisingly useful, especially from the lo sensitivity but that requires drive pedals to turn the rig into a “Fender-type” pedal platform pseudo-switcher. Picking dynamics are excellent in its natural state, a rather distant second to the NMV Marshalls, but very dynamic.

2555: Surprisingly dark for a Marshall. The sensitive EQ is alarming to work with for people used to classic Marshalls and the settings are significantly different, particularly the boosted bass. The grit is reminiscent of the 2203 (or 1959) but in a completely different way. The Marshall mids bark is there but it’s refined…smoother, perfected, no… neutered (like a Friedman etc: “improved“ to the point it’s no longer an improvement over the “real thing” but instead a cool and different shade that’s not really better at all). There is more gain. People with bat-like hearing (or those FOS and just doubling down on why DRs “suck”) swear they can hear the unpleasant character of the diodes in the signal and every other similarly-situated amp. I recall the amp being more accepting of pedals/speaker choices than the 1959 but still not as versatile as the 2203. Cleans are controversial. They have the gritty clean (sparkle) thing going that some love, but in the “all Marshalls clean” video, it was the most hated clean of those commenting. Dynamics are inferior compared to the MkII amps, which makes sense given the added gain. While a more serviceable channel switcher than the lo jack 2203, not really. The controls are not independent, making it impossible to get the clean you want and the lead you want, meaning one channel (or both) must suffer to operate live.

 

[marshallmellowed]

Actually, the first 800 model has the sound I'm talking about that my 2205/10's had. So hard to find any good videos. Don't pay attention to the gain and the overall crappy tone, listen to the upper mids. I can never find the right word for it, but it's kind of a "quack", and when you hear it in person it hits you in the face.

Those recordings sounded a bit muffled to me, 2203's are much more in your face. Sounded as if a blanket was over the cab, probably just the recording method used, typical youtube stuff.

 

[Vinsanitizer]

Understanding that “Marshall” has a generalized mid-focused voice from Plexi to DSL and the differences therein are subtle but perceptible.

2203: Bright as fuck. Out of a band setting, people like to keep either P and/or T low, otherwise you could practically break off the EQ knobs for what little difference they make. The distortion is “raw, open, aggressive” and “unfocused.” Outside of 70s rock, it benefits from (requires) a boost to compress/cut increasing lows and add drive, which blends seamlessly to its base tone, whether transparent or not. In addition to taking every “decent“ or above drive pedal effortlessly, it can sound great through a crazy selection of speakers. The clean tones are surprisingly useful, especially from the lo sensitivity but that requires drive pedals to turn the rig into a “Fender-type” pedal platform pseudo-switcher. Picking dynamics are excellent in its natural state, a rather distant second to the NMV Marshalls, but very dynamic.

2555: Surprisingly dark for a Marshall. The sensitive EQ is alarming to work with for people used to classic Marshalls and the settings are significantly different, particularly the boosted bass. The grit is reminiscent of the 2203 (or 1959) but in a completely different way. The Marshall mids bark is there but it’s refined…smoother, perfected, no… neutered (like a Friedman etc: “improved“ to the point it’s no longer an improvement over the “real thing” but instead a cool and different shade that’s not really better at all). There is more gain. People with bat-like hearing (or those FOS and just doubling down on why DRs “suck”) swear they can hear the unpleasant character of the diodes in the signal and every other similarly-situated amp. I recall the amp being more accepting of pedals/speaker choices than the 1959 but still not as versatile as the 2203. Cleans are controversial. They have the gritty clean (sparkle) thing going that some love, but in the “all Marshalls clean” video, it was the most hated clean of those commenting. Dynamics are inferior compared to the MkII amps, which makes sense given the added gain. While a more serviceable channel switcher than the lo jack 2203, not really. The controls are not independent, making it impossible to get the clean you want and the lead you want, meaning one channel (or both) must suffer to operate live.

Thanks V-man, that was a great read. You know what you're talking about, and nailed the 800's sound. Not sure I find it's "BAF", though it can be for sure. DSL's are brighter to me, I almost turn the T off, and the mids are "relaxed"). On my 800, I keep the T just below 2 and the P at 3-4 (the P and mid control are key for me). The bass control doesn't seem very effective past a certain point. I figured out early on that you have to back off the gain to where the low end isn't gravelly, then add a pedal to bring the gain back up. I like the OCD for its top-end aggression, but I prefer the Mad Professor Bluebird Overdrive b/c it has a nice boost in the mids - I always like to goose the mids @ around 700Hz (not 500 or even 800, but 700), because that's the area I like most on the Tom Scholz Rockman EQ.

Doesn't seem like I'd like the SJ at all.

 

[saxon68]

Email Nik at Ceriatone and he will hook you up with hand wired 2203 or 2204.

My 2204 is an amazing piece of work, especially with the bright cap that’s on push pull pot to get that 70s JMP sparkle, it cuts so good live!!

Throw a SD-1 in front and you’re in 80’s metal heaven, at 1/3 to 1/2 the cost of vintage or reissue. Oh and it’s hand wired, no PCB.

 

[Vinsanitizer]

Email Nik at Ceriatone and he will hook you up with hand wired 2203 or 2204.

My 2204 is an amazing piece of work, especially with the bright cap that’s on push pull pot to get that 70s JMP sparkle, it cuts so good live!!

Throw a SD-1 in front and you’re in 80’s metal heaven, at 1/3 to 1/2 the cost of vintage or reissue. Oh and it’s hand wired, no PCB.

Thanks, I might eventually. I saw that site this morning, the prices are down to earth.

 

[mickeydg5]

IMO.

I've had 'em, I've gigged 'em, I now have an SC20H, looking for a 2203 locally, there is no other.

The only Marshall that not only shakes your balls and punches you in the chesticals, but also slaps you in the face. No other Marshall can do it like the JCM 800.

What?
Metallica but not KISS?