Vintage Wah wah pedals

[Torren61]

So, what is the consensus on who currently makes the best vintage sounding wah pedal?

 

[Ivan H]

The lower hfe gain and quality of the vintage Transistors plays a very important part in the sound also.

Matching the hfe of the transistors ( 300 - 400 hfe)

This,,, most definitely plays a part.
For a couple of decades I used (my first ever pedal) a Roland AD50 doublebeat fuzz-wah that featured a ferrite pot-core inductor, until it was stolen between sets one night. As always, you don't know what you've got 'til it's gone.
Got a Zakk Wylde Cry Baby from a pawn shop to replace it, thinking Zakk Wylde, should sound ok. Wrong,,, it sounded like ass. Over time I true bypassed it, changed out the cap for the stock cry baby value, did the "stinkfoot" 3 trimpot mod etc. Got it sounding better, but still no cigar.
Then I read on a stompbox forum that the transistors used in the modern cry baby's were of way, way higher hfe than what was used in the old Vox wahs, also the suggested hfe range of 300 ~ 400.
The original Vox wah patent gave the transistor types used. So, I bought a handful of both these type transistors (NOS), tested hfe to find the couple best suited & fitted them. The pin-outs were different to the MPSA18 transistors that had been in there, so it took some creative positioning, but when I tried it out it was a night & day difference,,, much, much better. I've been using it with the stock red Fasel inductor for years, but do want to try winding a ferrite pot-core type inductor.

For anyone interested, the transistors used in the original Thomas Organ Vox wahs have the numbers 5117 marked on them. This is some sort of code, but not the transistor type designation.
The actual transistor "types" are;
Transistor 1 (or Q1) = 2N2925.
Transistor 2 (or Q2) = 2N2924.
(Either type can be used in either position successfully, from my notes).
For best results, transistor 1 should have hfe 400(ish), transistor 2 should have hfe 300(ish).
Remember though, if using these, the pin-outs are different to those of the MPSA18 etc used in modern cry baby wahs. Cheers

 

[AndyD]

@Ivan H I agree with your observations. Another good transistor to use, apparently, is the 2n5088 which has a similar hfe range to the 2n2924/5. A decent inductor and transistors go a long way to getting a great Wah sound……and there is the pot!

 

[yladrd61]

This,,, most definitely plays a part.
For a couple of decades I used (my first ever pedal) a Roland AD50 doublebeat fuzz-wah that featured a ferrite pot-core inductor, until it was stolen between sets one night. As always, you don't know what you've got 'til it's gone.
Got a Zakk Wylde Cry Baby from a pawn shop to replace it, thinking Zakk Wylde, should sound ok. Wrong,,, it sounded like ass. Over time I true bypassed it, changed out the cap for the stock cry baby value, did the "stinkfoot" 3 trimpot mod etc. Got it sounding better, but still no cigar.
Then I read on a stompbox forum that the transistors used in the modern cry baby's were of way, way higher hfe than what was used in the old Vox wahs, also the suggested hfe range of 300 ~ 400.
The original Vox wah patent gave the transistor types used. So, I bought a handful of both these type transistors (NOS), tested hfe to find the couple best suited & fitted them. The pin-outs were different to the MPSA18 transistors that had been in there, so it took some creative positioning, but when I tried it out it was a night & day difference,,, much, much better. I've been using it with the stock red Fasel inductor for years, but do want to try winding a ferrite pot-core type inductor.

For anyone interested, the transistors used in the original Thomas Organ Vox wahs have the numbers 5117 marked on them. This is some sort of code, but not the transistor type designation.
The actual transistor "types" are;
Transistor 1 (or Q1) = 2N2925.
Transistor 2 (or Q2) = 2N2924.
(Either type can be used in either position successfully, from my notes).
For best results, transistor 1 should have hfe 400(ish), transistor 2 should have hfe 300(ish).
Remember though, if using these, the pin-outs are different to those of the MPSA18 etc used in modern cry baby wahs. Cheers

Also the earlier Italian wahs used BC109B transistors, I like both of them to be right aroung 325 - 350 hfe.

 

[Torren61]

Any opinions on the best current manufacturer for vintage wah sounds?

 

[AndyD]

Any opinions on the best current manufacturer for vintage wah sounds?

You have some great builders in the states. Chase tone, McCon-o-Wah and Oxbow to name few for the replica Clyde wahs. The Fulltone Clyde standard is pretty solid. Over here we have Stuart Castledine. Depends on your budget. Some early 70s crybaby’s with trashcan inductors, 5117 transistors and ICAR pots can sometimes be found as bargains. They can sound fantastic.

 

[yladrd61]

Any opinions on the best current manufacturer for vintage wah sounds?

I have found that small independent effects builders make a far better quality product than the larger generic effects manufacturers. The best way is to get a donor wah for cheap and look for someone who sells mod parts of full drop in mod kits like Arteffect, Area 51, or Joe Gagnon there are quite a few of them out there.

 

[Gene Ballzz]

You have some great builders in the states. Chase tone, McCon-o-Wah and Oxbow to name few for the replica Clyde wahs. The Fulltone Clyde standard is pretty solid. Over here we have Stuart Castledine. Depends on your budget. Some early 70s crybaby’s with trashcan inductors, 5117 transistors and ICAR pots can sometimes be found as bargains. They can sound fantastic.

I have found that small independent effects builders make a far better quality product than the larger generic effects manufacturers. The best way is to get a donor wah for cheap and look for someone who sells mod parts of full drop in mod kits like Arteffect, Area 51, or Joe Gagnon there are quite a few of them out there.

What a great resource it would be to find a list of most of those folks, with at least accurate spellings or even links? Those who don't truly embrace wahs may not understand, but a really great wah can be almost as cool as a great guitar or amp! They certainly ain't just for "whocka- whocka-wah!" A great one can certainly help bring out the best of that great guitar/great amp!

There used to be a website with fairly detailed instructions for mods for the most common VOX and Dunlop wahs. They even provided descriptions of what different values in certain places accomplished. Sadly, that website disappeared a few years back and I was too stupid to download the info!

Just Wishin'
Gene

 

[DaDoc]

I have found that small independent effects builders make a far better quality product than the larger generic effects manufacturers. The best way is to get a donor wah for cheap and look for someone who sells mod parts of full drop in mod kits like Arteffect, Area 51, or Joe Gagnon there are quite a few of them out there.

I should look into that for my old wah!

 

[AndyD]

I have found that small independent effects builders make a far better quality product than the larger generic effects manufacturers. The best way is to get a donor wah for cheap and look for someone who sells mod parts of full drop in mod kits like Arteffect, Area 51, or Joe Gagnon there are quite a few of them out there.

Here’s a good vid!

 

[AndyD]

 

[Pete Farrington]

descriptions of what different values in certain places accomplished

Helmholtz undertook an exhaustive analysis (with frequency response plots) of wah circuit / components over at MEF https://music-electronics-forum.com...t-some-circuit-analysis-and-measuring-results

 

[AndyD]

Helmholtz undertook an exhaustive analysis (with frequency response plots) of wah circuit / components over at MEF https://music-electronics-forum.com...t-some-circuit-analysis-and-measuring-results

That was a really interesting read, thank you.

 

[DaDoc]

Thanks for posting that, now I'm getting fired up on rebuilding my old wah!

The only thing I would want would be a added DC input..I got away from batteries a long time ago, although I always want to keep the battery option, just in case!

 

[Torren61]

I broke down and bought a '68 Cry Baby. Trash can inductor, Ducati and "silver" tropical fish capacitors, half moon transistors. It probably won't get here for another week or two.

 

[Ivan H]

Thanks for posting this. I just bought the Sabbadius handwound halo inductor, saves me having to try winding one & for about the same $'s as the halo type ferrite potcore/wire kit costs.
Already have the correct transistors, tropical fish & polystyrene capacitors, just need the Allen Bradley carbon comp resistors & to make a board, & of course, the pot. Cheers

 

[Mick10]

JD Simo discusses his Wah pedal on a rig rundown

 

[AndyD]

I broke down and bought a '68 Cry Baby. Trash can inductor, Ducati and "silver" tropical fish capacitors, half moon transistors. It probably won't get here for another week or two.

Photos when you get it! Very jealous!

 

[AndyD]

Thanks for posting this. I just bought the Sabbadius handwound halo inductor, saves me having to try winding one & for about the same $'s as the halo type ferrite potcore/wire kit costs.
Already have the correct transistors, tropical fish & polystyrene capacitors, just need the Allen Bradley carbon comp resistors & to make a board, & of course, the pot. Cheers

I built a wah with all of the listed parts and it is wonderful! I used the 33K Q resistor (plenty vocal) and reduced the input resistor to 47K for true bypass. Great project.

 

[DaDoc]

You have some great builders in the states. Chase tone, McCon-o-Wah and Oxbow to name few for the replica Clyde wahs. The Fulltone Clyde standard is pretty solid. Over here we have Stuart Castledine. Depends on your budget. Some early 70s crybaby’s with trashcan inductors, 5117 transistors and ICAR pots can sometimes be found as bargains. They can sound fantastic.

I don't want to deviate too far from wahs, but what do you think of Sola Sound? I scored a ToneBender MKIV limited edition built by them a few years ago..I think it was called the "Fruit Salad" or something similar.

Hands down best damn fuzz I've ever seen..Awesome! It wasn't cheap but worth every penny..

You mentioned Stuart Castledine, I think at the time I was looking at some of their products as well..My impression was they and Sola sound are both very good effect pedal builders.