Why do we love 4x12 cabs, experience needed please.

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TheKman76

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This will be a slightly rambling and nerdish post, fair warning.

There has been an undercurrent of fascination for all things speakers in my life and one of the things that I've always wanted to understand better is why guitarists like their 4x12 cabinets so much. Obviously it's the way they sound, but exactly what property of the sound is it? And what factors contribute to that sound? I think the MF is the ideal group to answer this question!

OK, background theory.

Beaming:
Some of you will be familiar with the principle of 'beaming' as it relates to speaker drivers, it describes how sound emanating from a speaker can be either diffuse or directional based on the surface area of the drivers and the frequency of the sound. In the context of large drivers like 12" guitar speakers, high frequencies tend to be very directional, while lower frequencies tend to be omnidirectional.

Coupling:
Many of us will be aware that every time you double to number of speaker drivers used to convert X Watts of amplifier power you'll get a +3dB gain in output. This is a slightly more tricky concept to understand and has some caveats, but in essence a 4x12 should have a +6dB advantage in output over a 1x12.

So, through experimentation I found that by adding low-end to my guitar sound I liked it considerably better. I haven't played through a 4x12 in 30 years, but I remember being awe struck by the apparently natural low-end it produced. Less obvious but equally awesome was the airy room response which seamed to be a part of the space rather than from a point source. For all this time I assumed that this originated from the fact that the speaker drivers just didn't have to work as hard, the load was spread across more drivers, they can each sounds clearer or more natural.

Recently I had a theory that there was some cabinet resonance which contributed to the low end. Anyone who has practical experience with acoustic resonance will tell you it's often not very musical, unless considerable effort has gone into it's implementation. It didn't seem reasonable to me that an unbelievably agricultural 4x12 cabinet having no particular regard for resonance should be simply awesome to listen to. That would be an unreal coincidence. Sure, the Fender Bassman combo amps may have had some design smarts built in, but the vast majority probably have no great regard for the acoustics of speaker cabinets at all.

Finally today a couple of things seemed to fall into place.

Firstly is the coupling effect. I went and re-read some of the theory around this again and one phrase kept coming up, "at frequencies below the coupling wavelength". Right, of course, a 4x12 will really only couple completely at half-wave lengths larger than the combined diameters of the closely mounted drivers, call it 600mm. In practice this is more like twice that wavelength, lets call the full-wave length 2.4m. 340/2.4=~140Hz. Ok, so you'll get +6dB below around 140Hz, tapering off a little towards 300Hz or so before you start getting cancelations. Well, there's you low-end boost, right there!

Then I started thinking about the effect of having all those speaker cones moving in symphony. The proverbial 'wall of sound' effect. It's really a worst case scenario of high-frequency response according to the Hi-Fi speaker design handbook... but is it really? In Hi-Fi we'd try to maintain a point source for any given frequency range by making the driver area smaller and keeping the coupling distances between drivers to a minimum and designing the cross-over to suite. Avoid beaming, basic best practice. And yet, lots of people love the sound of open-baffle Hi-Fi speakers where the room is part of the speaker cabinet acoustics. Even more absurd, flat panel speakers can also sound amazing, presumably by means of filling a room with such a vast array of point sources as to render the actual source transparent. Owners of ribbon speakers enthuse about these features too.

So, I'm beginning to think that the property that makes our favourite 4x12 cabinets so good is simply the vast surface area of closely coupled drivers. Sealing the cabinet makes it more bass present, but the rest of the design is largely down to practicality and has little impact on the output.

If you've made it this far... you're a nerd. Welcome. ;)

What I'd really like to hear is experiences from player of 4x12 cabinets. Does any of this ring true? Is there something else to it?
 

TheKman76

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Does knowing all the science make it any different?

Maybe!? I may have mentioned I'm a nerd...

In truth, I'm a cheapskate when it comes to speakers. I'd much rather build a pair of Hi-Fi speakers from bits for a few hundred clams than spend thousand (... and thousands!) on something with a brand name that doesn't perform any better.

Guitar speakers make it a bit harder because the driver is a substantial part of the sound. There isn't really a way to design around them. Also, I will absolutely be castrated by the wife if I bring another "damned speaker" into the house. I picked up a 2x10 bass cab before Christmas in exchange for a six pack, purely to help my daughter's band practice, and only got away with it because it was for the band. 'Twas a close one, and I have to keep it in the workshop.

Maybe there's another way to re-produce this phenomenon using other means? I'd certainly like to find out.
 

JJ119

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There's something about a Stack or
1/2 Stack.
The MOJO for me personally was my 1st concert -- Thin Lizzy // Kansas.
Then as I went to Dio. Iron Maiden, etc,
there is the yearning for a 1/2 Stack, or, at least a 2 x 12.
I've heard really good things from a 2 x 12.

However, I am not nearly as Accomplished nor experienced as you guys!!
 

TheKman76

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For full volume:

4X12 25W = 50W
4x12 30W = 100W

If you mean that 1x12 versus 4x12 seems like twice the power, then I agree.

So, by that do you mean finding the 4x12 sound by another means through science?

Psycho-acoustics aside, it's all just an engineering exercise to me. It may be there isn't a better/cheaper/compact way to accomplish the same result, but if there's a way to bring the guitar cab industry into the 21st century, I think it's worth exploring. For instance, I have an image in my head of an array of four panel exciters (https://www.daytonaudio.com/product...xciter-with-shielding-30-mm-exciter-40w-4-ohm) mounted on a 600mm x 600mm panel with doped paper edge suspension and a sealed box.

I've experimented with them before and found that two of these exciters on ply panels made for a very efficient pair of speakers. For 5W of clean power I can get 105+dB between 200Hz and ~6kHz. These we 200mm x 300mm panels with one exciter each and no enclosure, mind you. Maybe I should wire them in series and plug 'em into the DSL, just because?
 

fitz

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I have an image in my head of an array of four panel exciters ... mounted on a 600mm x 600mm panel with doped paper edge suspension and a sealed box.
Actually, that seems kinda interesting.
I get the just an engineering exercise thing.
I'm curious as to the results.
 

TheKman76

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@fitz This isn't a new idea, people have made them before. Google "DML guitar speaker" and you'll see plenty. What I haven't found is a sealed enclosure style, they're all open baffle designs.
 

fitz

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@fitz This isn't a new idea, people have made them before. Google "DML guitar speaker" and you'll see plenty. What I haven't found is a sealed enclosure style, they're all open baffle designs.
Ok, cool concept for audio.
Search turned up vids of people putting the exciter in an acoustic guitar to make a speaker...

But guitar speakers are quite different.
How would a panel emulate a greenback, or such?
Just another speaker style for an interface & IR?
 

Karl Brake

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The acoustic science is interesting to read, though I get a little lost along the way. I do love using a 4×12 if I can possibly for it on the stage...there seems to be a much bigger sonic envelope and airy dimension to the sound. I use a Friedman 4x12 with greenies on top and v30s on the bottom, and, in spite of the beaminess, musicians at my gigs tell me that it covers the space really evenly, which seems to be bourne out by live videos. I use a Marshall Satch head whenever I can, and it seems to be a marriage made in heaven. My tone is always clear and present while still being balanced with the band. I wonder, though, about any space where I can't get a good 40' in front of the cab, which is the optimal sound wave reach of a 4x12, according to a sound guy I trust from LA. Something to that effect. It's just a resonant and sweet, organic sounding cab.
 

TheKman76

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there seems to be a much bigger sonic envelope and airy dimension to the sound.

My experience exactly. Regarding the 40' thing, I was at a gig recently where the guitarist faced his cab backwards into a timber paneled wall. Initially I though it was just a very plain B cab until I saw the speaker cable. Great sound too.

How would a panel emulate a greenback, or such?

I haven't gone far down this rabbit hole, but there are things like non-rigid couplings and blanking which can be used to tune response. That's step 473, I'm at step 0.5, asking stupid questions. :)
 

What?

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Sounds like a good analysis to me. I guess one big problem of going down that rabbit hole (aside from the airiness of multiple drivers) would be getting a satisfying tonality from a driver alternative to the signature curves of guitar speakers. That alone seems like a major endeavor to take on. So my hunch here would be, get a satisfying 112 sound from any guitar speaker alternative before moving on to the 412 problems.
 

paul-e-mann

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Too big, too loud, I have no use for a 4x12..................but with that said, it doesn't mean I wouldn't take one if someone gave it to me! I think what I would do is split the speakers left and right and make a pair of 2x12's housed in one box and load different speakers on each side. And have the ability to plug in as 4x12 too.
 

Kinkless Tetrode

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Coupling:
Many of us will be aware that every time you double to number of speaker drivers used to convert X Watts of amplifier power you'll get a +3dB gain in output. This is a slightly more tricky concept to understand and has some caveats, but in essence a 4x12 should have a +6dB advantage in output over a 1x12.

So, through experimentation I found that by adding low-end to my guitar sound I liked it considerably better. I haven't played through a 4x12 in 30 years, but I remember being awe struck by the apparently natural low-end it produced. Less obvious but equally awesome was the airy room response which seamed to be a part of the space rather than from a point source.
In my experience, and you asked for experience, the multi speaker effect is not 6db worth louder. A speaker like the Vintage 30 in a 1x12 will compete with a 4x12 with 97db speakers in loudness. Especially if the 1x12 is open backed or ported and the 4x12 is closed back. Going from 100db speakers to 97db speakers in the 4x12 will be a more significant difference. But the 4x12 will sound bigger or girthier, not necessarily louder. I think this is because the coupling effect is mostly in the lower frequencies
 

Matthews Guitars

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Any two or more speakers on the same plane are a phased array. A phased array is all about generating a beam. This is why you can have a cranked 100 watt amp into a 4x12 bottom and be able to stand off to the side and be reasonably comfortable with a volume level that allows you to easily control any feedback. But step in front of it, and you're in a totally different, much louder world and controlling feedback may be impossible.

Good idea, bad idea. Good idea:Standing beside a running jet engine to appreciate its power. Bad idea: Standing BEHIND a running jet engine to appreciate its power.

Same principle applies to 4x12s just with less heat.
 

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