Won't using an Attenuator contribute to shorter tube life?

[Kuga]

So return to return, eh?
Interesting.

Yes. Then it's like a volume pedal in the FXloop. FXloop pot at 10 no volume. FXloop pot at 0 full volume.

 

[DDJ34]

So I started out chasing a certain fuller sound that I only get at higher volumes and asking if an attenuator would get me there but at what wear to the tubes. But I ended up learning about 1. the V.P.R. function on my amp(that I never bothered with because I thought i was only using two tubes) and 2. the trick of linking both of my effects loop returns together with a patch cable to get an FX loop knob Master Volume. Using both I have actually somewhat attenuated my volume and come damn close to the fuller sound I was after.

THANKS MARSHALL FORUM!!!

 

[TonalEuphoria]

A wise man once said,…

“It Is Better To Blow Ones Tubes, Than To Blow Out Ones Ears”

Another wiseman said,


"It's better to have your tube blown, than just blow in your ear."


Both are wise to me.

 

[colchar]

I'll be able to get a killer sounding bedroom level, but I'll be burning up my tubes quicker. No?

No.

 

[colchar]

Correct.

No, it is not correct.

The problem with an attenuator is it fools people into playing the amp at high volume for long periods which can lead to things overheating and/or incurring damage.

Amps are designed to be played loud. Not constantly cranked, but definitely loud.

Without an attenuator, a person eventually gets ear fatigue playing at high volumes and is therefore more likely to take a break or simply engage in shorter sessions with the equipment.

 

[harleytech]

I have been using my Boss Tube Amp Expander for over 4 years and I still have the same tubes in my heads...

 

[Lance Chambers]

My TSL’s are still running their oem tubes……….using a PS-1 (and sometimes I pretend I’m Pete Townsend)…….

 

[Jethro Rocker]

A really loud TSL 100

With the master volume you really shouldn't need an attenuator at all. Not that much point.

Yeah. Looking for a 60. But not doable til later in the year.

It isn't a whole lot quieter than the 100 and is a bit of a different critter. Again, no point.

I am surprised you find it fuller using the fx loops. Once iy is set down to the same level it shouldn't really affect anything that way.

 

[Jethro Rocker]

Yes. Then it's like a volume pedal in the FXloop. FXloop pot at 10 no volume. FXloop pot at 0 full volume.

Which is like an extra master volume in the loop. I fail to see the benefit. It has good level controls for each channel.

 

[Frodebro]

With the master volume you really shouldn't need an attenuator at all. Not that much point.

It isn't a whole lot quieter than the 100 and is a bit of a different critter. Again, no point.

I am surprised you find it fuller using the fx loops. Once iy is set down to the same level it shouldn't really affect anything that way.

Nope. Most master volume amps get their grit from the preamp. I did some A/B comparisons with a few of my MV amps, bouncing between turning the MV down and using an attenuator (Rivera Rockcrusher) to drop to the same level, and the difference in tone is pretty negligible.

 

[Jethro Rocker]

Nope. Most master volume amps get their grit from the preamp. I did some A/B comparisons with a few of my MV amps, bouncing between turning the MV down and using an attenuator (Rivera Rockcrusher) to drop to the same level, and the difference in tone is pretty negligible.

Exactly. I mean, generally amps sound "better" when the master is up because the walls shake. That is a result of volume, not amp settings. Attenuate that down to low levels and no advantage.

 

[anitoli]

The only advantage i can see with attenuating an MV head is simply to drive a bigger signal through it and knock off some SPL's. In think MV amps respond/feel better to play when the circuitry is being driven a bit harder than bedroom levels.

 

[fitz]

I mean, generally amps sound "better" when the master is up because the walls shake. That is a result of volume, not amp settings. Attenuate that down to low levels and no advantage.

Yep.
Movin' air, or not movin' air.
MV's or attenuators can kinda sound sorta like a loud amp, but so does a decent OD pedal out front and a little EQ & TBE in the loop (IMO).
"Killer tones" at "bedroom volume" is just a simulation at best.

I'm not talking about the use of technology with DI, IR, or full-blown modeling and profiling and other such Jedi mind tricks.
Just saying a cranked amp into an attenuator isn't the magic recipe for low volume tone.

 

[scozz]

The only advantage i can see with attenuating an MV head is simply to drive a bigger signal through it and knock off some SPL's. In think MV amps respond/feel better to play when the circuitry is being driven a bit harder than bedroom levels.

That’s it, that’s how I use my attenuator with my little Sc20. When my wife’s not home I like to crank the master some, around 7 or 8, on the full power mode, knocking off a few db’s with my attenuator.

The master volume does break up, and blending the power amp and preamp drive, yields some great tones to my ears, and still retain some of my hearing. As we all know, 20 Marshall watts can get pretty loud, too loud to crank without attenuating, for me anyways playing at home.

When using attenuators they sound best when used to just knock off a few db’s, ime.

 

[DirtySteve]

I expected this thread to be at least 18 pages long by now. I do believe it's probably saved me a lot of cash so thanks.

 

[DDJ34]

With the master volume you really shouldn't need an attenuator at all. Not that much point.

It isn't a whole lot quieter than the 100 and is a bit of a different critter. Again, no point.

I am surprised you find it fuller using the fx loops. Once iy is set down to the same level it shouldn't really affect anything that way.

It's like I got my low-end back...but perfectly mixed.

 

[PelliX]

I also love how you couldn't respond to what I said, but had to call everyone who disagreed with you a clown.

Sometimes - and I can't lead by example here because I'm actually replying - people ignore the troll because eventually they'll go away. Perhaps Ken is a little wiser than I am, or simply can't be bothered.

You desperately need to learn that your opinion isn't fact. Hell, I bet you don't even know what 'opinion' means do you?

The same could, and I mean this sincerely, honestly and in a constructive way be said of your post which I'm responding to. I don't have any beef with you as far as I'm aware, but you're quite an abrasive chap at times. To then insinuate someone lacks lingual skills on an international forum is low. That's after you insinuated he was a "special" person, or in common language a retard. Yes, I'm from one of those generations where "retard", "idiot" and "moron" were still permissible insults. There was, however, no need to hurl them around in this thread - even if someone disagrees with you.

 

[PelliX]

so he got what he deserved

No, the thread de-railed and it became personal. I doubt your words provoked Ken to stop, consider and entirely re-think his ways. It didn't have to happen, that's all I'm saying.

And finally, my comment about 'opinion' was not about linguistics but was, rather, directed at a lack of intelligence and education.

See above.

 

[mAx___]

It is a fact of life that high volume levels cause output tubes to wear out faster.
Attenuators facilitate the conditions to shorter tube life. No question about it.

 

[agkellz]

It is a fact of life that high volume levels cause output tubes to wear out faster.
Attenuators facilitate the conditions to shorter tube life. No question about it.

Your technically right but the idea behind me getting an attenuator was to be able to acheive close to the tone i was looking for which was breakup at lower noise level.

If noise was not an issue for me i wouldn't use an attenuator but my amp would still be setup for breakup.