Diminished Unexpectations

[XTRXTR]

I learned guitar by ear. Once I figured the pentatonic scale pattern I practiced 10 to 16 hours a day when I was 14-17. Later found the full scale patterns and added those. I didn't know I was learning modes as well. Then found all the chords in those scale positions...etc. Added many chords from great artists that one would not normally think of in the position played that fascinated me. Played that way for 45 years.

Recently out of boredom, extended Covid break, I found a chord chart on the web. And I am surprised at four chord names.

Four string diminished chord with the same four strings and fingerings named four different names. G#dim, Bdim, Ddim, Fdim.

Four notes: open D, G#, open B, F. Except for Ddim the others are some inverted form.

I don't use diminished chords in the music I play nor many augmented, but a few exceptions.

Anyway, it may be because I learned by ear that this is interesting to me now after 45 years. I am also finding it fun to learn the names of the chords I've been playing for so long.

 

[playloud]

Yeah, diminished chords are nice theoretically because of the constant spacing: adjacent notes are all 3 semitones apart, so any diminished chord is an inversion of any of the constituent notes - as you've noticed. The diminished scale also has this constant "2-1" pattern which is easy to remember.

I find the challenge is using them musically!

I'm the other way round. Learned music theory (modes, circle of fifths etc.) before I could tune the guitar by ear. I wish it were otherwise, but I don't think I'm a "natural" when it comes to music. It's taken years for me to fake it!

 

[XTRXTR]

It's taken years for me to fake it!

If you're playing it...it's not faking it
At the least you are putting in hard work and maybe creating something.

Guitar Hero is the opposite...I hate it's idea or that it even exists. South Park had it square in their sites perfectly, that's a good couple episodes

 

[Jethro Rocker]

I learned guitar by ear. Once I figured the pentatonic scale pattern I practiced 10 to 16 hours a day when I was 14-17. Later found the full scale patterns and added those. I didn't know I was learning modes as well. Then found all the chords in those scale positions...etc. Added many chords from great artists that one would not normally think of in the position played that fascinated me. Played that way for 45 years.

Recently out of boredom, extended Covid break, I found a chord chart on the web. And I am surprised at four chord names.

Four string diminished chord with the same four strings and fingerings named four different names. G#dim, Bdim, Ddim, Fdim.

Four notes: open D, G#, open B, F. Except for Ddim the others are some inverted form.

I don't use diminished chords in the music I play nor many augmented, but a few exceptions.

Anyway, it may be because I learned by ear that this is interesting to me now after 45 years. I am also finding it fun to learn the names of the chords I've been playing for so long.

Very similar background. Except never practiced nearly that much.
Diminished are really cool, I think, because of that. It's fun to slide that chord up 4 frets each time and play same dim at different spots on neck.
I did teach myself theory in there I find it interesting but not necessary when one is up there wanking on the guitar.

 

[Dogs of Doom]

yeah, the cool thing about that chord, is, you can move up 3 frets, then 3 more, then 3 more, etc., arpeggiating the chord as you move up & up, & up, it makes for a good ascending pattern...

along w/ that, starting at the 6th string (low E), move down1 string & 1 fret. Then do the same movement, down 1 string 1 fret, like this:

E------------------9
B--------------8
G----------6
D-------5
A----4
E-3

note: 2 frets from G to B string, due to the different tuning interval of that string.

Now, practice trilling a ½ step trill on each string, so, for instance, on the 6th string, you are hammering & pulling off between the 3rd & 4th fret, then hop to the A string & do the same thing between the 4th & 5th fret. Continue moving on down the strings, moving along the pattern, trilling each string.

Now, do the same thing, but do a 1½ step trill, so, that on the E string, you'll start hammering & pulling off, between the 3rd & 6th fret, then A string 4th & 7th. W/ this one, you can also start doing alternate picking between the strings, so you can make a more fluid exchange up the scale. Doing this one, you are now playing a diminished scale, which is universal over the chords you learned to play, & moving up 3 frets...

If you don't know your harmonic minor scale, you should learn it. Then you can swap between the harmonic minor & the diminished, & mix a little minor scale action in their for good measure. Even a minor pentatonic can work, which will give you a fusion between, classical, blues & possibly some Eastern, Spanish/Gypsy type stuff, whatever you stumble on & get inspired by...

½ step trills:
E------------------9-10
B--------------8-9
G----------6-7
D-------5-6
A----4-5
E-3-4

1½ step trills &/or alt picking:

E------------------9-12
B--------------8-11
G----------6-9
D-------5-8
A----4-7
E-3-6

when doing alt picking, try this:

E--------------------------------------------------------------------------------9-12--9--12etc
B------------------------------------------------------------8--8--11--8--11
G-------------------------------------------6--6--9--6--9--9
D---------------------------5--5--8--5--8--8
A-----------4--4--7--4--7--7
E-3-6-3-6--6

go up/down. If you run out of notes & want to go further up/down, use the 3 fret rule (1½ step)

the page wants to move the characters out of sync, hopefully it translates well enough...

 

[playloud]

If you don't know your harmonic minor scale, you should learn it. Then you can swap between the harmonic minor & the diminished, & mix a little minor scale action in their for good measure. Even a minor pentatonic can work, which will give you a fusion between, classical, blues & possibly some Eastern, Spanish/Gypsy type stuff, whatever you stumble on & get inspired by...

"Yngwie hates this one trick!"

 

[Dogs of Doom]

"Yngwie hates this one trick!"

everybody in the '80s was using this formula. Uli Roth & Blackmore & to a lesser degree, Schenker & Page, in the '70s, but, Rhoads, Vivian Campbell, Gary Moore, anyone doing that whole thing, even Dimebag used it...

Carlos Cavazo, did a solo "Battle Axe" on the Quiet Riot album, somewhat trying to embark on a series of trademark Rhoads clichés...



Dimebag, using the diminished ascending:

 

[Dogs of Doom]

Gary Moore using the harmonic minor w/ the minor...

 

[Leonard Neemoil]

Dimebag, using the diminished ascending:

Probably my favorite Dime solo...

 

[XTRXTR]

"Yngwie hates this one trick!"

It's funny, I learned that kind of stuff listening to Yngwie... and Hordes of Locusts - Satriani, Kashmir, In the Light-Zep, Yes, a Heart song, the beginning of that Rush tune...La Villa strangle you something, Hotel California solo. If it is not used excessively (unlike Yngwie) you can impress a lot of people. That poor guy is misunderstood. The problem is IMO, you have to be able to play some of that to really feel it and maybe understand it; once you get there you fall into a rut using it too much. It is a kind of trap to shred all the time in that regard. Then you need to balance out by playing slow Gilmour type stuff and put real emotion into it, Time-Floyd solo is great for that. Then maybe move into SRV or Hendrix. To each there own.

When I was learning flute in 3rd grade they used call it the Hungarian minor scale...I think. I couldn't read, I just tried not to hit out of key. By the time I was in secondary school that was no longer my wind bag. Then I got the guitar bug. Just couldn't put it down, I used to play on my ten speed bicycle with no hands on the bars, everywhere I went, it was with me.