Finishing the Van Halen tone quest : I can tell you that pedals are where the gain come from

[pat_rocks]

Did you just... wait, did he say what I think he did...?



Well, I think you're finally starting to understand what some have been saying all along; many, many factors come in to play here. Fudge one thing somewhere in the signal chain and even if it's intentional, it can be hard to recreate yourself. Let alone someone else who doesn't know the exact chain involved or ever saw it.



Woah, no joke? An 1176... in a studio at that time? Or even today... what a surprise...



You know there are quite a few revisions of "the 1176" and it was not uncommon for studio engineers to make their own adjustments to the circuits, right? These were rack units, not pedals.



That signal chain is backwards, but OK. Are you still trying to replicate the record tone in the room, or are you planning on recording and such?



There are similarities, but I would instantly say something's off, honestly. Particularly at the end. Let's hear how the studio recordings go.



Whilst not the absolute creme de la creme, it's not going to be the element at fault here likely. Again, those studio recordings will be interesting to compare.

Hey at least i tried experimented and then corrected what i claimed. However there is the nice thing while everyone was telling gain and disto came mainly from the studio work this experiment proved me that the pedals were the main cause behind gain and distortion. No wonder why when angus young was once interviewed he said he saw eddies pedalboard he said something like it looked like someone going to the moon. he knew that eddies tone was in part inside his gear.

 

[pat_rocks]

Why would Gaustad want to use all the old stuff in today's world when he sounds as good if not better without it? Companies like Bray and Metro have really dialed in their amps to incorporate the Brown sound. IMO, these folks have nailed it, and any differences are attributable to things that just can't be recreated anyway without being in the studio.

I owned a bray 4550 deluxe i can tell you that a stock plexi with the exact same pedals that eddie have sound way closer than a bray deluxe. I can't say for the bray coco. I believe each bray unit is different perhaps some sounding great and some sounding bad. perhaps i got bad luck.



that was my unit. At first i thought i was the issue but when i sold it i knew i wasn't the culprit anymore. I sold it and i sold it to a big van halen fan who ended up trying to sell it directly after trying it and recieving it... 1day after recieving it he put it on reverb. This thing was stock and immaculate. I never opened it.

For the pedals there are many vintage transistors and chips that were the core of the sound of some pedals. Many of those are not produced anymore so pedal manufacturers look at the specs of those components and find some which have the same voltages and behavior but most of the times this is just an approximation and the price of manufacturing limits them in their choices. SO we end up with reissures or EVH gear that doesn't sound like the originals...

for example the mxr flanger had the sad1024 chip which sounded unique and hotter than what the actual mxr flanger uses. Both flangers act way differently when they encounter distortion. The newer versions overreact when they encounter distortion for example.

the critical one is the mxr 6 band eq i have 2 of them one from the 80 and one from the 70's they probably made revisions. The one from the 70's boosts way more the signal that the 80's one. Thats because of components change or revisions.

vintage pedals aren't always the same compared to modern replicas unless the pedal producer invests lots of money and time in RD and end up with a quite expensive pedal. A good example of this is schaffer replica or the uafx pedals. lots of RD, prices are high but it's high fidelity pedals.

 

[rmlevasseur]

I believe the coco is the one that is voiced for brown, and the other is a more stock plexi circuit. But Bray has lots of youtube clips that sound as close as anything I've heard with the exception of the Metroplex 2.

 

[pittbull]

Rockstah Mod 5 in my opinion is the closet

 

[pat_rocks]

I believe the coco is the one that is voiced for brown, and the other is a more stock plexi circuit. But Bray has lots of youtube clips that sound as close as anything I've heard with the exception of the Metroplex 2.

the question is are the YouTube clips really what the amps sound like in real life ?

The question is perhaps with a right micing technique you could easily make it sound like the records. But it doesn’t mean that irl you’ll get what you want.

I told David that the objective was mainly unchained and the early brown sound as the amp was a deluxe you can chose the tonality you want. Well for unchained the tone was spot on but for vh1 it was more like a muddy plexi than the brown sound. I was so disappointed to have spent 3k5 when I tried it. When I sold it David told me that he made the coco which was a way to offer cheaper and brown sound focused only amps. However the deluxe was supposed to be his ultimate amp.

But as I say each amp you build no matter what you do is different from each other. There are too many variables in town.

 

[pat_rocks]

Rockstah Mod 5 in my opinion is the closet

For recording sessions I believe that’s one of the best yes. I don’t know for in real life never tested them.

 

[rmlevasseur]

You are all over the place. Are you trying to replicate in the room or are you trying to replicate his tone in a recording? I'm telling you, replicating his sound in the room with a rig that specifically accounts for things like mics and all the stuff you hear on the record is gonna sound completely different at volume. These amps sound different based on the setting you put them in.

 

[pittbull]

My two main amps for the Van Halen 1 sound is my Rockstah Mod 5 and my Soldano SLO 100 case closed.

 

[DirtySteve]

Not that I know what to do with it, but I have the so called "brown sound" in spades, along with a lot of other cool sounds and all I have to do is turn on my Cameron/Jose high gain 'Plexi' and tweak the eq and gains.

 

[pittbull]

I had a cameron modded marshall years ago I never liked it sold it the amp sounded sluggish no clarity at all

 

[pat_rocks]

Not that I know what to do with it, but I have the so called "brown sound" in spades, along with a lot of other cool sounds and all I have to do is turn on my Cameron/Jose high gain 'Plexi' and tweak the eq and gains.

Now I believe that’s possible as I tried it with my Jose and it sounded close to the recording. Cameron is s Jose specialist.

 

[rmlevasseur]

My two main amps for the Van Halen 1 sound is my Rockstah Mod 5 and my Soldano SLO 100 case closed.

got any clips of the Mod 5?