Fryette PS-2a vs. PS-100

[FleshOnGear]

IMO the 100 is superior in every way based on features with the lone exception of the 2A’s ability to push two cabs simultaneously. Some cite the use of 6L6 replacement being cheaper than 6550s. My thoughts are the amount of times in a decade that’s necessary (if even once in a decade) make this a nonissue.

This is probably true for most people. I was just really unlucky, having to replace my 6550s twice in a year.

Yeah, I am probably overthinking the the tube thing. But I figured, both units sharing the same limited enclosure space (and ventilation) but with larger and hotter tubes could lead to a shorter lifespan in general. But you are right, I seldom have had to replace tubes. In fact, most of the time was not due to failure, but as a preventive measure or slight micro phonic artifacts that developed. And I mean really slight.

The 6550s do get pretty warm. I couldn’t say how much warmer than a pair of 6L6s. Regardless, the attenuation circuitry generates just as much heat when cranking a 50 watt amp through the unit for about 30 minutes. I can put my hand above the fan that ventilates the resistors, then above the tubes, and it feels about the same - the point being that both the PS2A and the PS100 will generate a fair amount of heat from just being an attenuator. IMO, the ventilation of the PS100 is sufficient. There are vents below and above the tubes, and none of the circuitry is in the way of the ventilation. I’ve only had my unit for a year, but I haven’t heard anything about the PS100 being less reliable.

TAE does a ton more, doesn’t color your tone with tubes and is cool as a cucumber.

Jus’ sayin…

The TAE is certainly worth consideration. I sometimes wish my PS100 was a solid state device, just because of reliability and ease of maintenance. It’s my opinion that the PS is quite transparent, despite its use of vacuum tubes. But that still begs the question, why not go with a SS power amp?

Ultimately I went with the PS because of the fact that the TAE runs your signal through AD/DA conversion all the time. I’ve come to realize that this reasoning was silly. My H90 pedal has no analog dry through, and I can’t hear any difference. Converters these days are amazingly good. I don’t regret my purchase of the PS100, though, partly because I bought mine before they raised its price, and partly because I don’t think I need the extra features of the TAE.

 

[guitardude57]

Me personally, I don’t have a need for such devices, and cannot think of any reason where I would.
Have the Friedman IR-Q four wire into a MX5 as effects only. That splits to a FOH feed and a rack amp to speaker for me.
No frfr junk.
The other rigs use either a split board, one going to front of amp, and the other thru the FX loop, or a small modeler (Flamma FX100) in front of my built Amp.
Have boosts when and where, multiple cabs for whatever gig.

I know a couple guys that use one of the Fryette units, I guess they like them to add FX I guess.

YMMV.

 

[V-man]

This is probably true for most people. I was just really unlucky, having to replace my 6550s twice in a year.

Your experience is remains valid and informative but it is unquestionably unique with respect to every single experience I have read about… in addition to my own. Ruling out the possibility of a bad run of tubes… IF the user wasn’t intentionally abusing it or professionally recording/touring some unheard of amount of usage, then once for the year would not make any sense and twice is absolutely impossible. Tubes would be the most likely, a malfunction would be next and both would be covered under warranty.

Ultimately I went with the PS because of the fact that the TAE runs your signal through AD/DA conversion all the time. I’ve come to realize that this reasoning was silly.

If your major regret is that you got a bad one, you’d be far more likely to draw the short straw on the TAE purchase considering the mass-produced product (from a reputable builder nonetheless)

Quoted from the “you” of TAE buyers (in a thread about TAE issues…)

Help, did I just fry my OT using the Boss Waza TAE or tubes?

So I just got the Boss Waza TAE today and just a few minutes ago hooked it up with my Wizard MTL and Marshall 2x12. I connected everything first before powering on the TAE, had the speaker cables in the right jacks and the ohm selectors both set to 8ohms (on amp and TAE). I start to play using...

www.rig-talk.com

First time I used the Waza TAE with my amp it blew a power tube and a fuse. I double checked everything and I know it was connected properly, updated to the latest firmware version, and the units turned on in the proper order.

I've had terrible luck with the Waza TAE. Everyone else seems to love it and the guitar tones on Youtube seem to be good. But I've tried two of them with my Super Lead, and that combination has produced some of the most awful guitar tones I've ever heard. Seriously. Sounds like the thing is broken as there's this horrendous dissonant "whooshing" sound that just won't go away, plus it sounds like it has a wet blanked on it through a set of Dynaudio LYD48 studio monitors. I've tried all the rig setups and have played around with most of the settings, but all that accomplished was to make the sound go from horrendous to terrible…

As for the AD/DA signal… no. It may be a regret of yours that in retrospect you could otherwise live with, but it’s no mistake by design or by other people’s choices/concerns. Abstaining from the “sounds the same (but does it feel the same)” argument, the features of that unit include a direct in for a tube power amp to use in conjunction with a preamp device. It is a global feature set that best covers all the bases of its options. Complaining about the valve folly of a top-shelf piece of gear… used to run a mid-tier build tube amp (regarding Marshall’s typical build quality) is a specious argument bordering on absurd. If tube gear is a problem then “tube gear” (all) is the problem and the argument shifts from Marshall > TAE to Fuck it all > Helix/Tonex.

 

[tallcoolone]

If your major regret is that you got a bad one, you’d be far more likely to draw the short straw on the TAE purchase considering the mass-produced product (from a reputable builder nonetheless)

Please explain this "mass produced products are more prone to failure" logic further...??

in a thread about TAE issues…

There are literally more threads about TAE issues than there are issues with TAEs lol. Tubes color your tone, create heat and need maintenance and replacement. Not to mention the plethora of things the WAZA can do that the PS cannot. Features that make a gigging guitar players' life MUCH easier. There is a reason Fryette/Suhr guy Pete Thorn tours with the WAZA.

 

[Theresa]

If heat is of a concern then try this solution.

 

[rmlevasseur]

having a tube section for wet is not a good idea imo. I'd much rather have a great attenuator/reamper with a solid state power section.

 

[Ronquest]

TAE does a ton more, doesn’t color your tone with tubes and is cool as a cucumber.

Jus’ sayin…

TAE is Filipino for POOP. Just sayin.

 

[FleshOnGear]

Your experience is remains valid and informative but it is unquestionably unique with respect to every single experience I have read about… in addition to my own. Ruling out the possibility of a bad run of tubes… IF the user wasn’t intentionally abusing it or professionally recording/touring some unheard of amount of usage, then once for the year would not make any sense and twice is absolutely impossible. Tubes would be the most likely, a malfunction would be next and both would be covered under warranty.



If your major regret is that you got a bad one, you’d be far more likely to draw the short straw on the TAE purchase considering the mass-produced product (from a reputable builder nonetheless)

Quoted from the “you” of TAE buyers (in a thread about TAE issues…)

Help, did I just fry my OT using the Boss Waza TAE or tubes?

So I just got the Boss Waza TAE today and just a few minutes ago hooked it up with my Wizard MTL and Marshall 2x12. I connected everything first before powering on the TAE, had the speaker cables in the right jacks and the ohm selectors both set to 8ohms (on amp and TAE). I start to play using...

www.rig-talk.com

First time I used the Waza TAE with my amp it blew a power tube and a fuse. I double checked everything and I know it was connected properly, updated to the latest firmware version, and the units turned on in the proper order.

I've had terrible luck with the Waza TAE. Everyone else seems to love it and the guitar tones on Youtube seem to be good. But I've tried two of them with my Super Lead, and that combination has produced some of the most awful guitar tones I've ever heard. Seriously. Sounds like the thing is broken as there's this horrendous dissonant "whooshing" sound that just won't go away, plus it sounds like it has a wet blanked on it through a set of Dynaudio LYD48 studio monitors. I've tried all the rig setups and have played around with most of the settings, but all that accomplished was to make the sound go from horrendous to terrible…

As for the AD/DA signal… no. It may be a regret of yours that in retrospect you could otherwise live with, but it’s no mistake by design or by other people’s choices/concerns. Abstaining from the “sounds the same (but does it feel the same)” argument, the features of that unit include a direct in for a tube power amp to use in conjunction with a preamp device. It is a global feature set that best covers all the bases of its options. Complaining about the valve folly of a top-shelf piece of gear… used to run a mid-tier build tube amp (regarding Marshall’s typical build quality) is a specious argument bordering on absurd. If tube gear is a problem then “tube gear” (all) is the problem and the argument shifts from Marshall > TAE to Fuck it all > Helix/Tonex.

I gotta say, V-man, you have a unique way with words. I generally have a ton of respect for your opinions and the thought you put into your posts, but I honestly often have no idea what point you’re trying to make. I might be misunderstanding you, but I just want to be clear - I think the PS is a great piece of gear, and I’m not too upset over the tube troubles. Shit happens, and tubes are replaceable. My point was just that I think my objection with the TAE didn’t necessarily have that much merit. I’m very happy with the PS, though.

 

[tallcoolone]

TAE is Filipino for POOP. Just sayin.

I don't care what you call it, as long as it does everything it does. I haven't schlepped a delay pedal or had to do 4CM in years. And full MIDI is awesome.

 

[Mark_G]

If you are producing 50 watts from 6L6s or 50 watts from 6550s how much more heat are the 6550s making ? If your at home and running a few watts, how much of a heat difference is there? At idle whats the bias difference? Is there that much more heat with 6550s when run at home power/volume levels?

Well, I'll certainly find out about some of those variables since I am committed to buying one of the two units. And leaning toward the PS-100.

 

[Mark_G]

If heat is of a concern then try this solution.

View attachment 156435

Very savvy.

 

[V-man]

Please explain this "mass produced products are more prone to failure" logic further...??

Make 1107 units as a quality US company you get X amount of units with problems. Make 5754 units overseas as a quality company, you get Y amount of units with problems. More TAEs, more with problems (against the many that don’t). The presumption is there will be a higher percentage of mass produced defects 1.5% vs 1%… maybe, maybe not

There are literally more threads about TAE issues than there are issues with TAEs lol.

That doesn’t exactly speak volumes in favor of the unit. Either some % of these posts actually do support a higher incidence of defects as stated above, or these are predominantly operator error posts, suggesting the additional problem users have learning/using the units, or both.

Regardless, You know what we don’t see? More PS bitch threads than PS units. And here’s what’s telling: both the PS and TAE are similarly expensive, meaning among other things that the same overall amount of TAEs and PS units were bought by that group of players willing to pay the premium. Thus, if there was as much of a reliability/learning curve issue with the PS, we’d near about it from those same people… and we don’t.

Tubes color your tone, create heat and need maintenance and replacement. Not to mention the plethora of things the WAZA can do that the PS cannot. Features that make a gigging guitar players' life MUCH easier. There is a reason Fryette/Suhr guy Pete Thorn tours with the WAZA.

Blah blah… and A/DA utterly destroys your analog signal. Yes, I can throw out the same baseless aspersions based on a complete lack of experience with the other unit as well. This isn’t 1960s-1970s tube amplifier design based on maximizing tube “tone coloration,” this is a 2010s-2020s reamplifacation device that has tube properties intentionally baked into the circuit design do deliver transparent tone.

And while Pete Thorn has found the right stick to scratch his itch his is hardly the majority opinion on the subject… at least with those reporting on the internet. That the TAE has many other features (that are gaining obsolescence and charging you for, wanted or not) is an entirely different can of worms.

What I don’t see amidst the “more threads complaining about the TAE than TAEs” are many threads praising the TAE’s A/DA transparency over the PS’s “tube coloration” for doing the same job they intersect at, Pete’s endorsement not withstanding.

What I have seen is a number of people who have plunked down on both favoring the PS in greater numbers for that same task. Not always, but more often.

???

Piggybacking off your post about a sentiment others shared regarding a nonsensical concern over using tube devices to run their tube devices.

 

[Burk]

I will be purchasing one of these Power Stations. No changing my mind on this. And a lot of my decision came from some of the valuable input by a lot of members on this forum in a similar thread I made recently. But...
Being very 'anal' and wanting to best assure that the one I get is THE right one for me has kept me from pulling the trigger. Thus, I have been doing extensive research about both units; both the differences and similarities. But some of the members here have used one or the other and so I can get direct feedback with your help.

This is my personal pro/con list only:

PS-2 Pros: cheaper than the 100 (and I cannot foresee needing the 100-watt ability, though it's nice), 6L6 tubes (cheaper to replace and with slightly less potential of overheating), it's been out a little longer than the PS-100 and has proven it's reliance (at least from what I have researched)
PS-2 Cons: A non foot-switchable FX loop

PS-100 Pros: Foot-switchable FX loop and secondary channel, (I can see using that secondary channel for a clean boost w/o having to use a separate boost in front of the amp - but it's not THAT important to me) 100w might seem like overkill to me now, but you never know....
PS-100 Cons: More expensive, the 6550 tubes will be more costly to replace and from what I have read, do run hotter than the 6L6's, understandably of course - and Steven Fryette himself concurred. And lastly, since it's been out for a shorter time, it's less time-proven.

*I should add that I prefer to not buy BOTH to try out and return one of them - primarily because I doubt I will notice any sonic differences between the two.

I intend to purchase one of the Power Stations in a few weeks (at least to get in the queue, since most are backordered anyway)
With that said, I am making a poll (kindly vote!) and from that - and also members comments, will ultimately help me in reaching a decision. Thanks to all in advance! And sorry for the long-winded post; I am kinda anal.

I’d look for a used PS-100 due to the fiotswitchable channel/boost & loop.

 

[peterplexi]

Make 1107 units as a quality US company you get X amount of units with problems. Make 5754 units overseas as a quality company, you get Y amount of units with problems. More TAEs, more with problems (against the many that don’t). The presumption is there will be a higher percentage of mass produced defects 1.5% vs 1%… maybe, maybe not


That doesn’t exactly speak volumes in favor of the unit. Either some % of these posts actually do support a higher incidence of defects as stated above, or these are predominantly operator error posts, suggesting the additional problem users have learning/using the units, or both.

Regardless, You know what we don’t see? More PS bitch threads than PS units. And here’s what’s telling: both the PS and TAE are similarly expensive, meaning among other things that the same overall amount of TAEs and PS units were bought by that group of players willing to pay the premium. Thus, if there was as much of a reliability/learning curve issue with the PS, we’d near about it from those same people… and we don’t.



Blah blah… and A/DA utterly destroys your analog signal. Yes, I can throw out the same baseless aspersions based on a complete lack of experience with the other unit as well. This isn’t 1960s-1970s tube amplifier design based on maximizing tube “tone coloration,” this is a 2010s-2020s reamplifacation device that has tube properties intentionally baked into the circuit design do deliver transparent tone.

And while Pete Thorn has found the right stick to scratch his itch his is hardly the majority opinion on the subject… at least with those reporting on the internet. That the TAE has many other features (that are gaining obsolescence and charging you for, wanted or not) is an entirely different can of worms.

What I don’t see amidst the “more threads complaining about the TAE than TAEs” are many threads praising the TAE’s A/DA transparency over the PS’s “tube coloration” for doing the same job they intersect at, Pete’s endorsement not withstanding.

What I have seen is a number of people who have plunked down on both favoring the PS in greater numbers for that same task. Not always, but more often.



Piggybacking off your post about a sentiment others shared regarding a nonsensical concern over using tube devices to run their tube devices.

Pete Thorn also uses a PS in the signal path to bring down the level of all tube amps he records to save his vintage speakers. He says it's transparent and cannot tell the difference in tone!

 

[SonVolt]

To clean up some confusion - I don't think there's defective TAE's on the market, I think it's the design of the unit itself that can harm your amp. There's a big thread over on TGP with Pete Thorn, John Suhr, and the Fryette Support account talking about it.

 

[jspete64]

I will be purchasing one of these Power Stations. No changing my mind on this. And a lot of my decision came from some of the valuable input by a lot of members on this forum in a similar thread I made recently. But...
Being very 'anal' and wanting to best assure that the one I get is THE right one for me has kept me from pulling the trigger. Thus, I have been doing extensive research about both units; both the differences and similarities. But some of the members here have used one or the other and so I can get direct feedback with your help.

This is my personal pro/con list only:

PS-2 Pros: cheaper than the 100 (and I cannot foresee needing the 100-watt ability, though it's nice), 6L6 tubes (cheaper to replace and with slightly less potential of overheating), it's been out a little longer than the PS-100 and has proven it's reliance (at least from what I have researched)
PS-2 Cons: A non foot-switchable FX loop

PS-100 Pros: Foot-switchable FX loop and secondary channel, (I can see using that secondary channel for a clean boost w/o having to use a separate boost in front of the amp - but it's not THAT important to me) 100w might seem like overkill to me now, but you never know....
PS-100 Cons: More expensive, the 6550 tubes will be more costly to replace and from what I have read, do run hotter than the 6L6's, understandably of course - and Steven Fryette himself concurred. And lastly, since it's been out for a shorter time, it's less time-proven.

*I should add that I prefer to not buy BOTH to try out and return one of them - primarily because I doubt I will notice any sonic differences between the two.

I intend to purchase one of the Power Stations in a few weeks (at least to get in the queue, since most are backordered anyway)
With that said, I am making a poll (kindly vote!) and from that - and also members comments, will ultimately help me in reaching a decision. Thanks to all in advance! And sorry for the long-winded post; I am kinda anal.

I have both..the 50 is more than adequate and can get just as loud as the 100,but the 50 has substantially less headroom..So if you are going to be cranking it,that may be an issue…also,they sound pretty much the same,but they don’t feel exactly the same..the 100 has more “weight”to the sound…it’s small,but it’s there…The alternate channel and switchable loop on the 100 is great,but you do lose the extra speaker jack of the 50…but you can use a Y speaker cable and run 2 cabs..and yes,the 100 does get hotter.tube amps get hot,they are designed for that so that’s a non issue…as far as tubes “coloring”the sound too much as opposed to a TAE,all power amps color the sound to a degree..with tubes it’s not about color,it’s about how a tube amp relates to the speaker as opposed to a SS amp..I had a TAE before the Fryette,and like every other SS amp I have tried,it’s darker,and lacks definition because of the difference in how it reacts to a speaker.I have had both for over a year,and have extensively AB’d them…I prefer the 100,because it does everything I want it to do,but the 50 is no slouch either…just comes down your application and use case..in fact,I am about to sell my 50,as I predominantly use the 100….also,if you have a small amp that you wanna make louder,the extra wattage comes in handy….just my 2 cents since I own both..they are both great,and once you have one,you will wonder how you got by without it..

 

[tallcoolone]

Make 1107 units as a quality US company you get X amount of units with problems. Make 5754 units overseas as a quality company, you get Y amount of units with problems. More TAEs, more with problems (against the many that don’t). The presumption is there will be a higher percentage of mass produced defects 1.5% vs 1%… maybe, maybe not

Sorry man, this doesn’t make any sense. I trust Roland/Boss in Japan to be at least as meticulous as the guys in Fryette’s back room. And I’m being facetious.

That doesn’t exactly speak volumes in favor of the unit. Either some % of these posts actually do support a higher incidence of defects as stated above, or these are predominantly operator error posts, suggesting the additional problem users have learning/using the units, or both.

Nah, it’s all because it’s Fryette. They are for some reason one of the darlings of the gear boards. At some point it was established that the PS was the “best” way to attenuate/reamp your signal. I’ve got zero against them—I did find the “R&D” kickstarter habit a bit distasteful but I guess I’m from another generation. Bottom line for me is what does the box take off my plate in use and at set up.

Blah blah… and A/DA utterly destroys your analog signal. Yes, I can throw out the same baseless aspersions based on a complete lack of experience with the other unit as well.

These are live tools for me, I’m not using this to get the greatest ‘Politician’ tone. I’ve been a gear hound since 1986, if this box made my amps sound any less than fantastic it wouldn’t have lasted a week.

And while Pete Thorn has found the right stick to scratch his itch his is hardly the majority opinion on the subject… at least with those reporting on the internet.

It scratches his itch because it flat out does a ton more. Having reverb/delay/compression/boost/eq/loop already in the box fully MIDI controllable is an absolute game changer.

That the TAE has many other features (that are gaining obsolescence and charging you for, wanted or not) is an entirely different can of worms.

Again, reverb/delay/compression/boost/eq/loop. Oh and presets. And adjustable load.

 

[Mark_G]

It scratches his itch because it flat out does a ton more. Having reverb/delay/compression/boost/eq/loop already in the box fully MIDI controllable is an absolute game changer.

Again, reverb/delay/compression/boost/eq/loop. Oh and presets. And adjustable load.

While I like the idea of the TAE being a kinda one and done unit, I wouldn't be taking advantages of all it's features. And I have no doubt it's an amazing piece of gear; same for the Ox, etc.
Originally, I just wanted a really good attenuater but soon realized having a unit that can increase the power from some of my smaller amps can be handy. So for me, I think the Fryette is a good fit. Seems pretty straight forward to use as well.

 

[SonVolt]

It scratches his itch because it flat out does a ton more. Having reverb/delay/compression/boost/eq/loop already in the box fully MIDI controllable is an absolute game changer.

Again, reverb/delay/compression/boost/eq/loop. Oh and presets. And adjustable load.

I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just curious b/c I don't play live anymore and haven't for a LONG time. Wouldn't a guy like Pete Thorn have a pedal board for his delay and reverb anyway? These sessions guys usually have pretty nifty pedalboards, so I'm surprised they'd give that up from some canned FX in a direct box. Again, i've never played through a TAE so the FX may be wonderful.

 

[tallcoolone]

While I like the idea of the TAE being a kinda one and done unit, I wouldn't be taking advantages of all it's features. And I have no doubt it's an amazing piece of gear; same for the Ox, etc.
Originally, I just wanted a really good attenuater but soon realized having a unit that can increase the power from some of my smaller amps can be handy. So for me, I think the Fryette is a good fit. Seems pretty straight forward to use as well.

Nah the Ox doesn't have any of these features. I heard it sounds good, but that's really all it brings to the table.

I keep reading that people wouldn't use the features...doesn't everyone use EQ, reverb and delay?

I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just curious b/c I don't play live anymore and haven't for a LONG time. Wouldn't a guy like Pete Thorn have a pedal board for his delay and reverb anyway? These sessions guys usually have pretty nifty pedalboards, so I'm surprised they'd give that up from some canned FX in a direct box. Again, i've never played through a TAE so the FX may be wonderful.

Yeah a huge part of the draw of the TAE is the fact that I use it for MIDI switching and time based effects. Delay and reverb in front of an amp doesn't sound 'right' to me so my only other choice is to run 4cm which live is a huge PITA. Now I can have a single channel amp and using the H90 and TAE have a plethora of footswitchable options--even down to using different IRs to FOH. When the Levee Breaks/Fool in the Rain solo/acoustic OTHAFA--all can be made much cooler switching IRs, even if my amp tone doesn't change.

I'm no fanboy, but this box makes life easier while allowing for more creativity.