Simple recording gear

[ricksdisconnected]

ok i have nothing then. w/o computer studio setup im at a loss.

 

[ibmorjamn]

So here's a question: would I be able to get something like, say, a BOSS 8-track recorder, create drum tracks using software on my PC (it'd be much easier on my PC for that), and then import those drum tracks to the recorder (or DAWS)?

Yes

 

[Vinsanitizer]

Ok, very well then. What would I need to go the full PC route? I imagine...

Software with full recording abilities including drums.
An upgraded audio card that has the required interfaces (in/out/MIDI, etc.)
Interface devices (mic's, keyboard, cables ...)

 

[nickfox]

Ok, very well then. What would I need to go the full PC route? I imagine...

I'm glad that you're open to looking at software solutions now. I have a strong feeling that we share a similar dislike of software for the same reasons.

I'm a mac person, so I chose logic pro. The industry standard DAWs are pro tools first and logic pro second. I'm not in to spending lots of money on recording equipment. One thing that I really like about logic is that it has *everything* you need to record including the easiest drummer software that I have found. With a good professional DAW, you don't need to buy any other software.

I have EZdrummer also and from my experience it did not integrate as well with logic pro. It certainly was not easier than the logic pro drummer.

All you do is create your song structure, ie. verse-chorus-verse-chorus, set the BPM and select drums from one of the dozen drummers or so. They each have about 10 styles to choose from and it's as easy as clicking through the different styles. There is a lot of ability to alter the drums to your needs.

It works well for me. And seriously, if there is someone on this forum that knows less about drums than me, I would like to meet them...

I know you prefer windows, so I hope this helps a little bit.

 

[ibmorjamn]

Ok, very well then. What would I need to go the full PC route? I imagine...

Software with full recording abilities including drums.
An upgraded audio card that has the required interfaces (in/out/MIDI, etc.)
Interface devices (mic's, keyboard, cables ...)

View attachment 109304

Looks like you’re going to need a trip to the lol
Most people will go with some focusrite interface but there are better setups , ones that have their own power supply ?
The actual software for the DAW is up to you how much you want to spend. I use Mixcraft but a lot people like Reaper. I personally would not fork out the cash for pro tools.

There is something to look in to before you buy the interface. In regard to amp sims. Probably not your bag but it is fun to me tweaking the amps and effects .

The helix is an interface as well as a amplifier that will go straight to front of house with lots of effects and can be used with a amp (4 cable method) or with a FRFR cab.

Line 6 Helix Guitar Multi-effects Floor Processor

Guitar Multi-effects Pedal with Amplifier Modeling, Simple Editing Interface, 12 Footswitches, Expression Pedal, Aluminum Enclosure, Analog and Digital I/O, and USB Recording Out

www.sweetwater.com

 

[RCM 800]

I bought a focusright 2i2 interface and run it into my PC laptop. Came with a mic and cable. Amp drum and keyboard plug ins were also included. Basically everything you need but talent and a guitar. Just learning how to use it but I made this today.

 

[RCM 800]

I bought a focusright 2i2 interface and run it into my PC laptop. Came with a mic and cable. Amp drum and keyboard plug ins were also included. Basically everything you need but talent and a guitar. Just learning how to use it but I made this today.

I should add the signal chain is in the video description if your curious. I mic'd the amp those arent sims.

 

[Calebz]

LOL! Nothing yet. I'm taking my time researching- - trying to imagine and sort out how I want things to work for me, then work through the limitations and compromises, so that hopefully, I'll end up with equip't I can enjoy using, rather than getting frustrated and giving, an feeling like I wasted cash on another dead-end adventure. I really don't like the recording process, but I have so much material over the years, I think I really should get some things recorded.

The answer here is - you need a friend with a home studio.

Seriously though, a 1 or 2 channel interface, a cheap laptop and reaper will get you most of the way there. Reaper will run on a potato. No high end gear required.

If you change your mind about your gear path, I'd be happy to make a list of things and ways to make the process less complicated than it looks.

That said, someone suggested the Zoom R16. I have one and I'll be honest, I sort of hate using it. The user interface is a pain the in the ass.

That said, once figured out and working properly, it is an awesome demo machine. Portable, light, decent sound quality and it can act in different roles - multitrack recorder, USB interface, or control surface. Mostly shit you probably don't care about right now, but gives you some options if you care later.

 

[PelliX]

I just try to keep the DAW as dumb as possible during the recording process and then lay loose with it for 'afterwards'. For a while I used crappy Behringer UMX25 just as an input device so there was no mouse/keyboard interaction. If you want to go EVEN simpler, consider a BOSS RC pedal. You can record, layered, loop AND snag the recordings in WAV format when/if you want. I'd be hard pressed to call it a recording solution, but it fits in your pocket, physically and budget wise. No tapes, no mechanical maintenance, easy offloading of data, comes with a metronome or a bunch of spartan drum tracks (ugh).

As for drums, I've tried various solutions, hard- and software. There are some decent software solutions, but indeed - quite effort intensive. My solution is 'bribing' a drummer... most seem willing to comply in exchange for alcoholic beverages. Can't beat the real thing...

 

[Vinsanitizer]

I just try to keep the DAW as dumb as possible during the recording process and then lay loose with it for 'afterwards'. For a while I used crappy Behringer UMX25 just as an input device so there was no mouse/keyboard interaction. If you want to go EVEN simpler, consider a BOSS RC pedal. You can record, layered, loop AND snag the recordings in WAV format when/if you want. I'd be hard pressed to call it a recording solution, but it fits in your pocket, physically and budget wise. No tapes, no mechanical maintenance, easy offloading of data, comes with a metronome or a bunch of spartan drum tracks (ugh).

As for drums, I've tried various solutions, hard- and software. There are some decent software solutions, but indeed - quite effort intensive. My solution is 'bribing' a drummer... most seem willing to comply in exchange for alcoholic beverages. Can't beat the real thing...

Therein lies my biggest hurdle: drums. I know how to play the drums. But I know how to play them far better in my head. So while I might be an ok drummer outward, I can be an "incredible" drummer in my head, which no one else can manifest but me. In order to accomplish getting it out of my head and into an electronic device requires me to spend so much time working on just the drum tracks before I get bored and go find something else to do. If I can't find a way to do it without having to spend hours (even days, as I have with drum machines in the past) just on drum tracks, then as I alluded to in my OP, this is not a venture I will peruse, and a path I learned my lesson from many years ago when DAWS had just entered the market. I just don't have the patience to punch pads all day, search for the right drums sounds, pick out the right kick, snare toms, cymbals, edit and correct every hit of the drum kit, correct velocities, sequencing, quantization, etc., etc., etc., all day long.

 

[PelliX]

Therein lies my biggest hurdle: drums. I know how to play the drums. But I know how to play them far better in my head. So while I might be an ok drummer outward, I can be an "incredible" drummer in my head, which no one else can manifest but me. In order to accomplish getting it out of my head and into an electronic device requires me to spend so much time working on just the drum tracks before I get bored and go find something else to do. If I can't find a way to do it without having to spend hours (even days, as I have with drum machines in the past) just on drum tracks, then as I alluded to in my OP, this is not a venture I will peruse, and a path I learned my lesson from many years ago when DAWS had just entered the market. I just don't have the patience to punch pads all day, search for the right drums sounds, pick out the right kick, snare toms, cymbals, edit and correct every hit of the drum kit, correct velocities, sequencing, quantization, etc., etc., etc., all day long.

Fair enough. I can play the intro to Paradise City. That's my drumming in a nutshell. And We Will Rock You. But uhm, wouldn't it then be easier to convey what you're "thinking" to an even better drummer to play? You rough it out and point out what you want but can't quite do?

 

[Dean Swindell]

Not sure which forum this goes in, so I'll throw in the Backstage for now.

Any suggestions on simple recording units? Like maybe a 4 or 6-track thing with some FX? Definitely not looking to build a recording studio, just a box or two and a couple of mic's - if I even do it all. I also don't want to do it off my PC, because then you have to deal with software, RAM, HDD space, crashes, blah, blah. I've been writing a few new songs again lately, kinda thinking about recording them, or at least getting some decent sketches down on something better than a phone voice recorder app. I've delved into home recording a long time ago, but I just have little patience with menus and scrolling and knobs where traditional sliders belong, etc. But the hardest part was always getting drums down right. And you need a good drum machine for that. I've had the Alesis drum machine, and one those early 2K's Roland boxes. I'm really meticulous about getting the drums perfect, but trying to get all that perfection out of my head and into a drum machine would take me so much time and effort, that I would get burned out on the song and gave up before I even finished the drums. Preset drum tracks aren't for me, those are just tracks to jam to, not for building your own songs with.

Has technology in this realm advanced enough to make it simple, easy and portable? I wonder if I could actually find it fun, instead of a PITA for once.

Thanks.

Try a Tascam DP-03. Cool and simple 8 track machine, easy to dump tracks and keep going too. Sweet sounding reverb.

 

[mirrorman]

So here's a question: would I be able to get something like, say, a BOSS 8-track recorder, create drum tracks using software on my PC (it'd be much easier on my PC for that), and then import those drum tracks to the recorder (or DAWS)?

I know that you can do that into the Tascam 8 track DP03. I write drum tracks into my Guitar Pro software, then export them as WAV files to the Tascam with a USB cable.
Easy peasy.

 

[Calebz]

Fair enough. I can play the intro to Paradise City. That's my drumming in a nutshell. And We Will Rock You. But uhm, wouldn't it then be easier to convey what you're "thinking" to an even better drummer to play? You rough it out and point out what you want but can't quite do?

This is what I do. Rough it out with an e-kit, maybe augmented by some loops or manually placed fills. Finding the 'right' kick, snare, whatever isn't necessary.. just close enough - the right general flavor.

When the idea/demo is done, I can pass it on to a real drummer and he can do real drummer stuff with it.

 

[Vinsanitizer]

Try a Tascam DP-03. Cool and simple 8 track machine, easy to dump tracks and keep going too. Sweet sounding reverb.

I saw those on AMZN - cheap, under $300. Does it have a drum machine? Does it have everything you need to record a whole song except instruments, mics, and out board gear?

 

[Vinsanitizer]

Fair enough. I can play the intro to Paradise City. That's my drumming in a nutshell. And We Will Rock You. But uhm, wouldn't it then be easier to convey what you're "thinking" to an even better drummer to play? You rough it out and point out what you want but can't quite do?

Maybe, but I don't want to have to rely on other musicians, when I can do everything quite well myself. Otherwise, I might as well just start up a new band and get back to fighting and arguing and disagreements and members not showing up on time again.

 

[Cal Nevari]

Not sure which forum this goes in, so I'll throw in the Backstage for now.

Any suggestions on simple recording units? Like maybe a 4 or 6-track thing with some FX? Definitely not looking to build a recording studio, just a box or two and a couple of mic's - if I even do it all. I also don't want to do it off my PC, because then you have to deal with software, RAM, HDD space, crashes, blah, blah. I've been writing a few new songs again lately, kinda thinking about recording them, or at least getting some decent sketches down on something better than a phone voice recorder app. I've delved into home recording a long time ago, but I just have little patience with menus and scrolling and knobs where traditional sliders belong, etc. But the hardest part was always getting drums down right. And you need a good drum machine for that. I've had the Alesis drum machine, and one those early 2K's Roland boxes. I'm really meticulous about getting the drums perfect, but trying to get all that perfection out of my head and into a drum machine would take me so much time and effort, that I would get burned out on the song and gave up before I even finished the drums. Preset drum tracks aren't for me, those are just tracks to jam to, not for building your own songs with.

Has technology in this realm advanced enough to make it simple, easy and portable? I wonder if I could actually find it fun, instead of a PITA for once.

Thanks.

Hi Vinsanitizer,

Tascam makes great, intuitive stand-alone recording devices. I loved my old cassette tape recorder, but there was always that hiss of the tape. They make really good digital recorders, as does Boss. My suggestion would be to check out this one from Tascam:

DP-03SD | 8-TRACK DIGITAL PORTASTUDIO w/FADERS | TASCAM - United States

TASCAM has developed a recording equipment and tools for music production for musicians and creators.

tascam.com

Or this one from Boss:

BOSS - BR-800 | Digital Recorder

BR-800: Digital Recorder - The Complete, Portable Music-Production Solution

www.boss.info

There are, of course, many others and you could likely pick up a used one on Reverb or eBay, depending upon how much you want to spend. I love my BR Micro but that involves a lot of menus. These units utilize straightforward sliders and knobs right on the unit for simplicity. As for drum machines, I had one of these Boss DR 770 units ages ago and just loved it:

BOSS - DR-770 | Dr. Rhythm

DR-770: Dr. Rhythm -

www.boss.info

It was easy to set up songs using blocks (intro, verse, pre-chorus, chorus, bridge, solo, and so on). I expect their newest iteration, the Boss DR 880, has the same versatility:

BOSS - DR-880 | Dr. Rhythm

DR-880: Dr. Rhythm - The Next-Generation Rhythm Machine

www.boss.info

This has something called EZ Compose that seems to use building blocks to allow you to create songs without having to do a deep dive. Seems to have a slew of Boss effects, including COSM amp modeling, built in

I have not used one of these, though, so someone else might be able to comment on their utility. Another nice thing about the Boss DR units is they have bass parts programmed that you can use with the drums parts, making laying down basic tracks very simple and quick. This approach lets you avoid the computer/DAW route with all of its baggage.

An inexpensive digital recorder and drum machine, along with a microphone, ought to allow you to unleash your creative potential, as the ad copywriters always seem to say...

Hope that helps!

Cal

 

[Vinsanitizer]

Hi Vinsanitizer,

Tascam makes great, intuitive stand-alone recording devices. I loved my old cassette tape recorder, but there was always that hiss of the tape. They make really good digital recorders, as does Boss. My suggestion would be to check out this one from Tascam:

DP-03SD | 8-TRACK DIGITAL PORTASTUDIO w/FADERS | TASCAM - United States

TASCAM has developed a recording equipment and tools for music production for musicians and creators.

tascam.com

Or this one from Boss:

BOSS - BR-800 | Digital Recorder

BR-800: Digital Recorder - The Complete, Portable Music-Production Solution

www.boss.info

There are, of course, many others and you could likely pick up a used one on Reverb or eBay, depending upon how much you want to spend. I love my BR Micro but that involves a lot of menus. These units utilize straightforward sliders and knobs right on the unit for simplicity. As for drum machines, I had one of these Boss DR 770 units ages ago and just loved it:

BOSS - DR-770 | Dr. Rhythm

DR-770: Dr. Rhythm -

www.boss.info

It was easy to set up songs using blocks (intro, verse, pre-chorus, chorus, bridge, solo, and so on). I expect their newest iteration, the Boss DR 880, has the same versatility:

BOSS - DR-880 | Dr. Rhythm

DR-880: Dr. Rhythm - The Next-Generation Rhythm Machine

www.boss.info

This has something called EZ Compose that seems to use building blocks to allow you to create songs without having to do a deep dive. Seems to have a slew of Boss effects, including COSM amp modeling, built in

I have not used one of these, though, so someone else might be able to comment on their utility. Another nice thing about the Boss DR units is they have bass parts programmed that you can use with the drums parts, making laying down basic tracks very simple and quick. This approach lets you avoid the computer/DAW route with all of its baggage.

An inexpensive digital recorder and drum machine, along with a microphone, ought to allow you to unleash your creative potential, as the ad copywriters always seem to say...

Hope that helps!

Cal

All of the comments posted here have basically allow me to bounce side-to-side down the hallway to find some sort of balance point in all of this.

Cal, I like how you basically put in in a package by saying, "An inexpensive digital recorder and drum machine, along with a microphone, ought to allow you to unleash your creative potential...". No matter which way you do it, it seems drum tracks are going to be work, so I'd just have to double down and accept it, unless going full PC, which I'm not doing at this point.

I've looked at the Tascam and BOSS DAWS, and also the BOSS and Alesis drum machines. I've used both the original Alesis (can't believe they still make those) and the BOSS DR-770.

Currently consider a Tascam, since they basically started it all with the Porta Studios way back, but comparing both where I might not want to limit myself to just 8 tracks - If I'm going to spend money, I might as well have more than I need, instead of risking not having enough. I think the DR-880 would be the drum machine.

So piecing those together, I think my choices would narrow down to:

1. Tascam DP-03SD 8-track ($285) + BOSS DR-880 = ($400) = $685.
2. Tascam DP-24SD 24-track ($400) + BOSS DR-880 = ($400) = $800.
3. Tascam DP-03SD 8-track ($285) + Alesis SR18 ($270) = $555.
4. Tascam DP-24SD 24-track ($400) + Alesis SR18 ($270) = $770.

After that, is there any particular mic you guys can recommend that would be an "everything" mic for electric and acoustic guitar and vocals?

 

[Barfly]

What is that - like, you go and pick pre-made patterns and and fills, and just assemble them together? That sounds like it'd work.
The rest is very helpful as well.

I use EZ Drummer3 now mostly and I like it It has a search feature where you tap in a simple pattern, ex. Kick, Snare, Kick Kick Snare and it gives you a bunch of suggestions of beats and if they are chorus, verse.. etc. I have a drum machine, boss something or other that I should sell. P.I.T.A. I never looked back.

PS: Listened to your first song old material. Excellent but I was like, shit! Vin can croon. Haha. Good stuff. I have to listen more later.

 

[10kDA]

Cakewalk by Bandlab is a free as in f-r-e-e DAW. It used to be state of the art, back before Gibson bought Sonar and the IP. It's still pretty good, and TBH a learning curve and/or the occasional glitch are way easy to take when your investment is $0.

I used to use a couple of those pencil mics for guitar and voice but now I use Shure SM57 for recording electric and acoustic guitar and SM58 for vocals, just like on stage. The numbers are probably appalling to purists but I get a decent vocal sound right away with very little messing around. It's already somewhat lo-fi going in so you don't have to run a plugin to add lo-fi "character" when processing the track in the DAW. This is what I do and I like the results; as always, your mileage may vary.