DSL20C or 20CR for small apartment

[PelliX]

Yes, it has emulated out.
No, I've never tried it.
Yes, it's been said it sucks.

It does. Don't. It does. There's subjective, and there's a massive noise floor combined with loss of any headroom, bass and treble. The e-out falls into that second category, I'm afraid.

I haven’t heard a Marshall D-out, or E-out that sounds anywhere close to good.

Actually, the DI on the SC20 isn't half bad. Unfortunately, it only works if the amp is off standby (whereas the E-out on the DSLs is always on), but it works quite OK. I was pleasantly surprised by that. I don't actually use it, but it's there.

You’re right about the power tubes in a Dsl20 @fitz288, and the Dsl20 is the only Dsl that actually can get some power tube distortion.

Mine doesn't, though it does seem to lose a bit of headroom on the Green channel when dimed. Maybe if you slam the preamp as hard as possible that changes, but I'm dubious. The DSL1 can actually get some of breakup going in the output stage due to the fact that it uses two 12AU7/ECC82's for that whopping 1 Watt. The DSL5 uses a single 12BH7A - I would expect similar behavior, but I've never tried it first hand. The DSL20 uses two EL34's, cathode biased. They're nowhere near their limits in that amp.

 

[fitz]

You’re right about the power tubes in a Dsl20 @fitz288, and the Dsl20 is the only Dsl that actually can get some power tube distortion.

It only occurs at high volumes though from what I've read.

Now you've got me thinking...
I have a way to test this.

If I run my DSL20 through the Bad Cat V2, I can crank the amp at a whisper out of the speakers and compare to the same volume w/o the BC - and vice-versa with the speakers smokin'.

I'll report back later...

 

[PelliX]

Now you've got me thinking...
I have a way to test this.

If I run my DSL20 through the Bad Cat V2, I can crank the amp at a whisper out of the speakers and compare to the same volume w/o the BC - and vice-versa with the speakers smokin'.

I'll report back later...

Looking forward to this - I tried exactly that and came back from it shrugging my shoulders....

 

[fitz]

Looking forward to this - I tried exactly that and came back from it shrugging my shoulders....

I'm expecting much the same.
I did a similar experiment with my O20H of cranked amp through the BC vs. just a good OD pedal at TV volume.
The result to me was..., a shrug.
Results are subjective.
The amp has other knobs than volume.
EQ in the loop is a game changer - as you say, full stop.

 

[jb5150]

I imagine I don't need the footswitch to run the reverb on this amp, do I?

The little crap I bought the amp from isn't answering my texts. I know he has the footswitch, saw it in the photos (after the fact). He probably hoped I'd miss it (which I did obviously) so he could use it for his 5150 III. I don't live gig and it's not like I'm missing it, but would've be nice.

 

[fitz]

I imagine I don't need the footswitch to run the reverb on this amp, do I?

The little crap I bought the amp from isn't answering my texts. I know he has the footswitch, saw it in the photos (after the fact). He probably hoped I'd miss it (which I did obviously) so he could use it for his 5150 III. I don't live gig and it's not like I'm missing it, but would've be nice.

FS does channel switch & loop on/off.
Reverb is always on (where you set the knob, that is).
Any 2-button TRS switch will work.
Supports LED, but not required.

 

[jb5150]

FS does channel switch & loop on/off.
Reverb is always on (where you set the knob, that is).
Any 2-button TRS switch will work.
Supports LED, but not required.

Thanks. Any good 3rd party switches come to mind?

 

[fitz]

Thanks. Any good 3rd party switches come to mind?

Mojotone.
Used Marshall switches available on Reverb & GC.
Any 2-button - even if the labels don't match, the functions will work.

 

[jb5150]

I notice at low volumes the amp is a bit fizzy...doesn't seem to be an EQ setting. Any workarounds for this?

 

[PelliX]

I notice at low volumes the amp is a bit fizzy...doesn't seem to be an EQ setting. Any workarounds for this?

Low volume or low volume control setting?

Low volume => it's your speaker and your ears (there's some science there I'll let you google yourself )

Low volume setting => dial it back with the BB or get an attenuator and turn the MV up.

I really don't want to kick this hornet's nest, but I found a pair of JJ EL34 replacements for the (JJ) Marshall branded EL34's reduced a bit of fizz. Might just be that the rest is more dominant, no hard numbers on this one, I'm afraid.

 

[fitz]

The little crap I bought the amp from isn't answering my texts. I know he has the footswitch, saw it in the photos (after the fact). He probably hoped I'd miss it (which I did obviously) so he could use it for his 5150 III. I don't live gig and it's not like I'm missing it, but would've be nice.

Wait, did you get the 40C?
Thread title and short term memory loss - I was talking about the DSL20 footswitch.
Not sure what you need for the 40C, or if it does reverb.

 

[jb5150]

Wait, did you get the 40C?
Thread title and short term memory loss - I was talking about the DSL20 footswitch.
Not sure what you need for the 40C, or if it does reverb.

Yep. 40C, using it in full power mode.

 

[fitz]

Yep. 40C, using it in full power mode.

Ok, disregard what I said about the DSL20 2-button footswitch, other than there are used ones on Reverb and sometimes GC.
No clue if the 40C uses the same as the 40CR.
I think there are multiple footswitches that can be used?
Fairly sure the CR can also do MIDI, but again, no clue on the C.

 

[PelliX]

DSL40C has no MIDI, DSL40CR does, indeed. The pedal should be the Marshall PEDL 91016. I'm not sure exactly how this pedal works, but I think it contains a microcontroller which deals with the input and does some very, very elementary TTL type communication with the amp. If that's the case, you want the real deal, or skip the hunt and go for a MIDI pedal, if you have the CR. I was also thinking of the DSL20, I think @fitz288 and I started rambling about it and lost track of the thread there...

I'm leaving the bit about the little shit shortchanging you out of this, for brevity's sake.

 

[jb5150]

So I've noticed the tone fluctuates from thin sorta slight buzzy, to full and thick at random at the same volume.

I believe the clean channel is fine. If so, do I just replace the power tubes?

My immediate guess is the tubes need replacing, it is after all a used amp (2018).

I can't fault the owner as it's buyer beware, and Im cool with that - shit happens, tubes fade over time.

Just confirming does this sound like a tube issue? If so, what's the best stock option? (I'm hearing prices are through the roof due to the Ukraine war)

 

[Moony]

Just confirming does this sound like a tube issue? If so, what's the best stock option? (I'm hearing prices are through the roof due to the Ukraine war)

When was the amp produced? Look at the sticker with the production date.

It's very unlikely that all tubes are worn out if it's an amp from 2018 that wasn't used that often (you said "mint condition").

I recommend JJ ECC83S and JJ EL34II tubes.
It's up to you if you want to replace all 12AX7 at once or just buy one new 12AX7 and change spot for spot to see if the problem goes away.

Maybe it's a different problem.
Wouldn't hurt to resolder some connections of the tube sockets, too.
Take care about lethal voltages in the amp!

 

[jb5150]

When was the amp produced? Look at the sticker with the production date.

It's very unlikely that all tubes are worn out if it's an amp from 2018 that wasn't used that often (you said "mint condition").

I recommend JJ ECC83S and JJ EL34II tubes.
It's up to you if you want to replace all 12AX7 at once or just buy one new 12AX7 and change spot for spot to see if the problem goes away.

So it's the pre-amp tubes?

 

[jb5150]

When was the amp produced? Look at the sticker with the production date.

It's very unlikely that all tubes are worn out if it's an amp from 2018 that wasn't used that often (you said "mint condition").

I recommend JJ ECC83S and JJ EL34II tubes.
It's up to you if you want to replace all 12AX7 at once or just buy one new 12AX7 and change spot for spot to see if the problem goes away.

Maybe it's a different problem.
Wouldn't hurt to resolder some connections of the tube sockets, too.
Take care about lethal voltages in the amp!

JJs are solid I put them in my 5150.

I can always take the 12AX7s from my 5150 (it has 5), it's just sitting.

 

[PelliX]

So I've noticed the tone fluctuates from thin sorta slight buzzy, to full and thick at random at the same volume.

And you're sure it's the amp? Have you tried this without the FX loop engaged (or just with a jumper cable)? Guitar straight in, nothing else?

I believe the clean channel is fine. If so, do I just replace the power tubes?

If it's channel dependent, it's now the output (power) stage. All channels share that. It's probably your V1B, V2x, etc (first valves, preamp section, ECC83/12AX7 type).

My immediate guess is the tubes need replacing, it is after all a used amp (2018).

Could be by the sounds of it, one might be dying. Some last 50+ years, some only a few hours. The good bit is, get a couple spare, they're cheap and swap them out until you find the bad one. Then you also have a spare or two, without taking another amp out of service.

I can't fault the owner as it's buyer beware, and Im cool with that - shit happens, tubes fade over time.

Output valves, yes, the preamp not so in just a few years generally. But, like I said, they can die or degrade at any time.

Just confirming does this sound like a tube issue? If so, what's the best stock option? (I'm hearing prices are through the roof due to the Ukraine war)

Could be. Narrow it down, see above. Could be, though.

Ideally you want a balanced, low noise+microphony ECC83 to test each position with. That way you could use it as a replacement for V1 (low noise+microphony) or the PI (balanced). Any ECC83 would do though, don't break the bank. Use the V1 from your 5150, maybe.

 

[Moony]

So it's the pre-amp tubes?

I don't know what's wrong with your DSL40C.
As I've told you I would have bought the one from the shop that you've played.

Fluctuating sounds are not neccesarily common with bad tubes.
Sometimes the sound goes bad as the tube heats up (that can be a bad solder joint too as I've mentioned before) - but then it's normally not constantly fluctuating in a way that the good sound re-appears (unless you shut it down for a while and then power it on again).

Try the 12AX7 from your Peavey in the DSL40C and listen if it sounds better then.

Ideally you want a balanced, low noise+microphony ECC83 to test each position with.

I think balanced 12AX7 are not necessary in a guitar amp.
"V1" ones are always nice - I only buy these selected ones because then I could change the order how I like it best soundwise and always have a "V1" selected one in the first spot.