Digitech RP1000 - Who, What, When, Where, Why, and How?

[beammeupwelshy]

That's a nice usable rig you've got there mate. Granted the AVT may not be all tube, but I've found them to be very underrated amps. I like them. And coupled with that RP1000, you've hort a pretty nice rig there w/out seeking your soul to the devil.

I always seem to struggle with finding that "unity" volume & gain with amp. I get there, but it always seems to take me horas too get it just right. I day if a patch level of 40 gets you there... Ruin with it. Shoot, I may have as go at it as well...



Cheers man. I have slowly been putting a half decent recording rig together for a while now, but yeah just wish i could stretch the budget to a tube amp. One of these days i guess.

I'm just tweaked i found this thread cos so far there isn't much buzz about one of the coolest pedals i reckon there is at the moment. I know everyone raves about line 6 and the boss GT series and i know they have more tweak-ability etc etc, but hands down I really can't look past this thing now its great, you can tweak a fair amount but mostly its just setup to start playing.


As for quebase, i've never even tried to use that one. I mostly stick with Sonar cos i know how to use it now. I'm guessing that there's some good stuff available if you use quebase with the driver for the RP but, but I really can't be bothered to learn a whole new DAW. Besides I like to mic my amp up anyway, can't really go wrong with an sm57 stuck down the throat of a half descent amp.

 

[beammeupwelshy]

I just figured something out.

Actually it would seem that Digitech figured it out and I'm just a little bit retarded.

Anyway:

Earlier I complained about the amp loop and amp/cab models not being fully controllable by foot switch (see above for exact beef). Basically I wanted one to turn off if the other is turn on and vice versa.

It boils down to the Amp/Cab bypass button. I thought this was the only way to disengage the on board preamp, and this is a global switch that you need to physically bend over and push with your finger. A little annoying as I elaborated on earlier. However what I didn't realise is you can actually just leave the Amp/cab preamp on for every patch you have and set the amp model and speaker model to "direct". In the Manuel it says its this is the same as bypassing the preamp.

In this way you can store a patch (in pedal board mode or preset mode) as having the amp loop on/off and the inbuilt preamp on/off, any combination goes and the amp/cab preamp button is just there as a global switch that you might want to use if (for whatever reason) you want the internal preamp to be bypassed at all times.

Brilliant. Now I can basically do literally what ever I want, short of killing hookers and going a drunken cross country drive of carnage. But other than that I'm sonically challenged no longer.

I know this might also be a bit sacrilege on a Marshall forum, but I also purchased a Laney GH100L head. I'm giving up my dream of a stereo setup with my avt275 and going mono in the never ending search for the perfect valve tone. Originally I would have liked to get a JCM800 but I got an awesome deal on the Laney and being that I'm in NZ we get payed shit and everything is overpriced, I couldn't pass it up. At the moment Im running it through the AVT's speakers until i can find a decent Marshall cab that doesn't cost the earth.

So far I'm loving the tone and the volume. The AVT is a loud amp but the 100Watt Laney just pisses all over it and sounds so good doing it. I would love to compare a JCM800 with it just for a comparison.

Anyway, the rp1000 hasn't missed a beat i basically re-patched it into the Laney and had to adjust the master volume of the RP1000 a little as the preamp (FX send) on the Laney is none adjustable (this just got me running at unity gain) then I just played it and all my patches sounded like they did, only with more awesomeness and toooooonnnnnnnnnnneeeeeeee. Alright.

 

[joshuaaewallen]

I'd say keep the AVT and run it in stereo with the Laney as a wet/dry rig. That's what I do with my TSL100. I run all the effects wet through my Bugera 333, and keep my primary tone through the Marshall dry. This set up sounds totally killer. Very three-dimensional, so the effects saturate nicely, but the main tone doesn't get lost in the effects. Plus by keeping one amp dialed in on the lead channel, and the other dialed in on the crunch channel, the different eq'ing really can fill in the gaps and just sounds massive and rich.

 

[beammeupwelshy]

Cool.

Can you elaborate on your setup? I have seen a few gear setups on the net using multiple amps but it always confused me a bit. Are you saying you run your Marshall all the time and the FXs only go through the 333, which also runs all the time. Or are you using the preamp of one amp and then patching the FX rtns to the power amps of each amp?

I was thinking about running the AVT through the RP then into the power amp stage of the Laney to see what that does to the AVT tone. Though I'm more impressed with the Laney's tone in general compared to the AVT so maybe I could put the RP through that preamp and then run an FX rtn to the Laney power amp and the AVT power amp and see what that sounds like.

So many options. Although I do feel in my heart of hearts that I'll end up making it as simple as possible (one amp) as I tend to favor simplicity over multiple options, but I certainly would be a fool not to experiment while I have two amps sitting around.

When i got my AVT275 I was really excited because I really wanted a stereo amp for Stereo FX RTN. This has certainly been cool to have, the reverbs have more depth, the delays do crasy panning things etc, but in reality whenever I record my guitar I do it dry (except random FX based parts) and I double track (one pass left, one pass right) so I guess I actually would never need guitar stereo FX for any reason other than its cool to have it.

Still if Marshall brought out a two or more channel amp with a tube stereo power section I would totally save my pennies for one. They should bung a TSL or even mode four in a box with the Rack mounted 50 watt stereo amp, call it "the stereo death machine" and just see what happens.

 

[roaster]

Hey Guys

Keith from the UK here.

I have a Marshall JVM410C with a JVMC2x12 Cab, sort of a half stack but still portable. I got the RP1000 a few months ago but I have been struggling with the "squeal" issue on OD1 & OD2 Orange and red so I went back to individual stomps powered by batteries- no squeal! Im pretty sure its something to do with noise getting amplified through the loop so I have been investigating if there is something else I could power the RP with. The modtone power plant has an AC output at the right rating but before I do that (Its £179) Im going for a cable overall using van damm cables and Neutriks custom made by a small Co in the UK called "KABL" I'll let you know how I get on when I hook up the 4 cable RP1000 again. And gues what, I couldnt fathom why I couldnt get good patch volume from the modellers- doh! discovered the preset level at the end of the WAH row! Great thread Josh, someone to share thoughts with on the RP 1000

 

[roaster]

Just another word of warning guys when using xedit. It seems there is a bug which means if you drag and drop the patches into different orders, the patches themselves go "unstable" in the RP1000, the delay time you had before isnt the same after you have moved the patch in xedit, and other weird things so be warned.

 

[beammeupwelshy]

Cool.

Ive mainly been using xedit to back up the few patches that I have made so far but that's good to know. Maybe they need to bring out a new firmware upgrade soon.

 

[joshuaaewallen]

Thanks for the info on the xedit. I haven't, that I know of, done much dragging and dropping, but I have used it extensively for creating patches.

As far as the 333 & the TSL go... I have been using them simultaneously. Both rockin' at the same time, and it's really filled in the sound. I AM LUVIN" IT.

 

[beammeupwelshy]

Is the squeal you refer to like a feed back type sound that comes on way to early and over the top? Or is it more like introduced noise into the overall signal you end up with coming out of your speakers, sort of like white noise? If its the first it could be just that the gain structure of your system is a bit off, it its more like white noise then if could be badly filtered power or some other gremlin.

I haven't actually used a JVM as of yet but I beleive they have a an FX level send knob? (Sorry btw if this is telling you stuff you already know) I would suggest that you figure out your levels first before spending 170 quid. Thats like $600 to me.

When I got my Laney I had to figure out where I should set the FX loop level RTN Knob on the Amp (not a send level, send level is fixed on these). This gave me the level that the preamp feeds a signal into the power amp stage. This should work for the Marshall as well, basically when the RP1000 is in the JVM's FX loop (which it is the 4 Cable method) you need to have the preamp of the JVM going into the RP1000 then the Power amp section of the JVM as though (level wise) the RP isn't in the loop. When you do this set the RP to bypass mode with the amp loop still active.

Thats easy enough, but because you have level adjustment on the FX loop of the JVM and master level output on the RP, you need to figure out the balance point between the system. You may have to compare the level of the JVM with with the RP patched in and unpatched to make sure they are about the same. Once you've done that adjust all of the patches in the RP to be at the volume you require, like your clean patch might be a bit quieter and the distortion patch might be a little bit louder etc. If you still have squeals than something else is going on.

On my Laney the Pre amp is just cranked and that feeds the RP which has a max input of +4dbu (something like that, its heaps anyway). So i just have to make sure that I'm not stuffing this signal back into the power amp stage way to hot.

Hope that all makes sense it sounded good in my head.

 

[beammeupwelshy]

Thanks for the info on the xedit. I haven't, that I know of, done much dragging and dropping, but I have used it extensively for creating patches.

As far as the 333 & the TSL go... I have been using them simultaneously. Both rockin' at the same time, and it's really filled in the sound. I AM LUVIN" IT.

Sweet, I have heard good things about those 333's, I was considering one until I found a Laney on Trade Me (ebay) at bargain price.

 

[roaster]

Thanks slima,

Its not feedback but deffo a sort of introduced a phased white noise type sound but I thinks its born in the effects loop. I have it 100% wet on the varaible mix knob which you have to otherwise it sounds totally phased on anything less than 100% if you use 4cm. I have just bought 4 new leads (Neutriks and van damm) and will try again this weekend at the gigs. I do think its a power noise issue but its not home as it occurs everywhere I go except when I use batteries in the single stomps when I dont use the digitech. The noise gate almost kills it in the RP but when the gate opens you can hear it trying to come back in. If the ISP G string does the same thing then there will be no point in getting it.Its only on the high gain channels though.

On a side not guys, how do you set up a "signature" in the post like Josh's that displys all your gear etc - Thanks

 

[beammeupwelshy]

That does sound like an power issue. From what I have been reading about lately on an electronics forum most AC to DC transformers for pedals etc, don't filter the power and the pedals usually don't either, so maybe you do need to get a nice power supply.

I had a metal Zone that was noisy as hell with a crappy AC - DC Adapter but worked mint with a 9Volt battery, shame I ended up hating how it sounded once I figured that out.

This site is has a bit of good info on this type of thing.

Beavis Audio Research

 

[joshuaaewallen]

Signatures are easy... You can tweak all that by going to your user profile and clicking on "customize profile". From there, "edit signatures" will be in the column on the left side of the screen...

 

[joshuaaewallen]

Re: Digitech RP1000 - Recording:

Well, this afternoon I had a pretty healthy go at trying to record using my TSL122 & my RP1000... (I prefer the sound of my amp to the modeling of the RP1000, so I'm bypassing all the modeling of the RP and just using it for some effects.)

One thing I have thus far concluded... I do not like the sounds when recording via USB. The clean guitar parts sound flat, and the distorted guitar parts sound flat and fizzy...

What I mean...

Clean: http://kiwi6.com/uploads/hotlink?id=887n4i74pc

Clean & Distorted:http://kiwi6.com/uploads/hotlink?id=1s2aoah1y5

Now... I did have, in my opinion, much better results using the emulated line out on the back of my Marshall right into my laptop's sound card. First here's a recording of the main riff from Def Leppard's "Let It Go" off the High n' Dry album, and second (my first real attempt at doing a multi-track recording) me tinkering away at a brief demo-ish recording of Def Leppard's "Foolin'" off the Pyromania album.

"Let It Go": http://kiwi6.com/uploads/hotlink?id=9obie428a0

"Foolin'": http://kiwi6.com/uploads/hotlink?id=11on9qb3y3

So... Being I don't have a mic', mixer, or any of that kinda stuff... What are your thoughts? Any suggestions?

______________________________________________________________

I've had to trim the fat a wee bit, so I sold the Bugera, the Marshall cab from the TSL, and the Tone Bone switcher. I'm down to my Wilder Modded TSL122 ran through the Digitech RP1000 into the PRS 2x12 cab...

 

[beammeupwelshy]

Cool playing. I see what you mean about fizzy, that's been my experience with usb and direct from amp recording as well. My AVT275 has an emulated line out too but it always sounds too tinny sounding or something. These days i just use my trusty sm57 mic and use a presonus firestudio project for my audio interface and i get a pretty sweet sound when the neighbors are out and i can crank my amp.

It sounds as though the best option you have at the moment is the TSL emulated out into your computer. Those riffs sounded pretty good as they were. Not sure how the guitars are panned in that song but try recording a part once and pan it left, then on anther track record another take of the same part and then pan that right. This gives your guitars much more width, its like two different guys playing the same riff in each speaker, plus you could change pickups or amp settings for either side to give it more variation and thus make it sound even wider. Might help to give the tone more depth.

If you can afford it you could always get a presonus USB box (or what ever they call them) and a shure sm57 mic. Then you can mic up your cab and you will get an awesome tone from that TSL, im sure. I only say presonus because they are really well priced and I've never had a problem with my stuff, but there are so many options these days there would be heaps of cool interfaces you could look at.

Cheers.

 

[joshuaaewallen]

Thanks slima,

Its not feedback but deffo a sort of introduced a phased white noise type sound but I thinks its born in the effects loop. I have it 100% wet on the varaible mix knob which you have to otherwise it sounds totally phased on anything less than 100% if you use 4cm. I have just bought 4 new leads (Neutriks and van damm) and will try again this weekend at the gigs. I do think its a power noise issue but its not home as it occurs everywhere I go except when I use batteries in the single stomps when I dont use the digitech. The noise gate almost kills it in the RP but when the gate opens you can hear it trying to come back in. If the ISP G string does the same thing then there will be no point in getting it.Its only on the high gain channels though...

I too have begun to notice a lott of extra hiss when I run through my RP1000 using the 4 cable method. It's gotta be either the RP1000, the effects loop on my amp, or both, because if I plug the guitar strait into the input on the amp there's a crap load less noise in the signal (even on the lead channel). Have any of you his found this to be the case, and if so, what were your solutions?

 

[beammeupwelshy]

I must say that I'm not getting any of this at all. I do get alot of niose with my laney gain all the way up, but thats the same even with out the RP, Ive read they are notoriously noisy amps, but its all underneath the actual guitar signal so i dont hear it when Im playing anyway.

Couple of quick thoughts:

When you are using the amp loop (as in, using your guitar amp preamp) you have the internal preamp of the RP bypassed by either pressing the button to bypass or by setting the amp and cab models to direct?

One of your leads could be faulty?

You could have the FX send level set to high/low out of the guitar amp? Or your RP master volume isn't loud enough?



On a side note I have altered my gain structure a bit after messing around with my 4cable method the other day. I was under the impression my Laney was outputting at a very hot level, but i tested it into a mixer and it sends out a -10dbv signal (semi-pro line level), which is well within what the RP1000 can handle.

So now what I do is turn the Rp1000 master volume all the way up. Then i play my guitar going through the RP in bypassed mode with the amp loop still active. This gives me a reference to work with, from there i just make all my patches to be the approximate same volume level using the patch level control, or make then a little louder/queiter depending on what they are for. Seems to work great with my laney.

I would imagine using the Four cable method in theory would introduce extra noise as there is more cabling and connections and more chance for earth loops etc, but I don't think (done right) there would be any noticeable difference, I certainly don't hear any if I change it all back. So I'd say something must be up with something in your chain somewhere. I doubt it'd be the RP, but who knows, we seem the be the pioneers of this thing at the moment, still can't believe the amount of people who don't know it exists.

Good luck with your noise.

 

[joshuaaewallen]

... When you are using the amp loop (as in, using your guitar amp preamp) you have the internal preamp of the RP bypassed by either pressing the button to bypass or by setting the amp and cab models to direct?

Don't think this is it... I usually bypass all amp models (99% of the time) since I totally love the sound of my Marshall.

... One of your leads could be faulty?

That is a possibility. I'll have to start switching out leads to see if that is it... Lord knows, with a 20' guitar cable and the three other 10' cables employed to use the 4cm I've probably managed to introduce a crap load of noise right there...

... You could have the FX send level set to high/low out of the guitar amp? Or your RP master volume isn't loud enough?

I don't think this is the trouble... On the Marshall the effects loop is parallel the entire way, until you max it out on the knob, then it becomes series.

... I have altered my gain structure a bit after messing around with my 4cable method the other day. I was under the impression my Laney was outputting at a very hot level, but i tested it into a mixer and it sends out a -10dbv signal (semi-pro line level), which is well within what the RP1000 can handle.

So now what I do is turn the Rp1000 master volume all the way up. Then i play my guitar going through the RP in bypassed mode with the amp loop still active. This gives me a reference to work with, from there i just make all my patches to be the approximate same volume level using the patch level control, or make then a little louder/queiter depending on what they are for. Seems to work great with my laney.

I would imagine using the Four cable method in theory would introduce extra noise as there is more cabling and connections and more chance for earth loops etc, but I don't think (done right) there would be any noticeable difference, I certainly don't hear any if I change it all back. So I'd say something must be up with something in your chain somewhere...

This actually makes a bit of sense to me... There a lot of crap going on in my signal chain, so I could try raising the RP's master and lowering the patch levels to get to unity volume...

... I doubt it'd be the RP, but who knows, we seem the be the pioneers of this thing at the moment, still can't believe the amount of people who don't know it exists...

Crazyness... For how versatile these babies are you'd think folks would be beating down the doors to get one!

On a side note... Last night, just for kicks and grins, I played the RP1000 strait through the stereo alone (no amp at all). I must say, this is one handy box to have around. If I ever start gigging it'll be much easier to have that for a backup than lug around another whole amp!

 

[roaster]

I have tamed the noise on mine a little, I wrote to digitech on the subject and they said that paralelle loops (even those that become series when they have a level knob) do have some phase variance issues and that the RP1000 was designed to work best with a dedicated serial loop. (My JVM has both)

I also got some 3 meter custom pro planet waves cables and routed the loop cables away from the left hand side of the amp as you look at it as with other cables when the noise was occurring it altered and went quieter when you moved the leads.(Microphonic? but these were van damn)

The only other source it could be is the digitechs wall wart, The mod tank has a dedicated AC output that would power the digitech but it is very expensive and I dont want to buy if it doesnt cure it

 

[beammeupwelshy]

I have tamed the noise on mine a little, I wrote to digitech on the subject and they said that paralelle loops (even those that become series when they have a level knob) do have some phase variance issues and that the RP1000 was designed to work best with a dedicated serial loop. (My JVM has both)

I also got some 3 meter custom pro planet waves cables and routed the loop cables away from the left hand side of the amp as you look at it as with other cables when the noise was occurring it altered and went quieter when you moved the leads.(Microphonic? but these were van damn)

The only other source it could be is the digitechs wall wart, The mod tank has a dedicated AC output that would power the digitech but it is very expensive and I dont want to buy if it doesnt cure it

1 That is quite bizarre, I wouldn't have thought it would make a difference as long long as the loop was set to fully serial. Good to know.

2 That kind of sounds like the transformer hum might have been induced on the cables or something along those lines. Perhaps one of your van damn cables had a faulty solder on the shield and was allowing interference in.

3 Not sure if you are from the states or the UK? In NZ we use European type power 230/240V 50Hz, I can't say anything about the transformers they use elsewhere, but I don't notice any undue noise using mine. Though, keep us informed as if it helps might be worth doing it even if there isn't any audible noise.

Cheers, and Merry Christmas to everyone.