DSL40CR- Help dialing the amp in - Tone questions

[BatmansMarshall]

Mitch is right the SC20H is a superb amp and I had one for a few weeks. I still needed a Tubescreamer to get the sound I wanted.
Regarding the Origin amps, they are very hard amps to get sounding good ( apart from clean ) in a store. You need to understand the relationship between the MV and gain levels and Tilt.
I recall last year trying one in a store expecting to hear DSL levels of gain and I laughed it off thinking it was terrible.
However for using it either cranked loud and gain maxed it’s a pure Marshall Rock
sound and one of the most articulate tones you will find. Perfect for a band mix.
The alternative at home etc or is to make it a pedal platform amp and stick everything up front. Avoid tubescreamer pedals as they suck the bass out of the Origin. Stick a good OD pedal in the front and the amp comes alive and can provide such a great tone. The Origin amp is one of the most misunderstood and under appreciated amps Marshall have made. The great thing is they are lower priced and more compact in size and just sound great when you discover how to dial it in

IMO, the Origin is the amp Marshall never wanted to release because it's a foundational Marshall amp upon which you can add pedals to make it sound like nearly every other Marshall amp on the market. Marshall amps have a pre-amp stage that heavily colors the Marshall's tone. You can't get rid of it (and why would you as it's the reason you got it) and even the clean channels have their color. The Origin, however, is very different as the gain has more headroom and the pre-amp stage coloring is not so dense. When the amp is cranked with no pedals you hit hard rock/very early metal and no more. So with that sort of headroom and plain palette to paint from, Marshall knows the right pedals before it, especially a good pre-amp pedal can turn it into anything else they have. Origin is really a no brainer for anyone who already has developed such a pedal selection.

Marshall has likely offset the costs for the Origin IMO. My guess is that the premium price of the studio series helps cover the lower costs of Origin. This is how they are competing with profilers, lunchbox series amps, and Fender type pedal taking heads.

 

[Whizzinby]

The SC 20 H would be your end of amp shopping, plus you can get some really great things with your pedals.
Cheers

What tonal differences are there between the DSL and SC20H?

 

[Mitchell Pearrow]

This is an IPhone clip of my Origin 50H and an SD1 clean boost in front, and a 2019 LP Traditional .
Cheers

 

[Mitchell Pearrow]

What tonal differences are there between the DSL and SC20H?

The SC20 H is a bit more old school than the Dsl , and the Origin is even older than that, I purchased the Origin amps because for the pair I am still putting out less coin than I would have for a 1987xl.
YMMV but the Origin is a perfect pedal platform, in my ears.
Cheers

 

[Whizzinby]

This is an IPhone clip of my Origin 50H and an SD1 clean boost in front, and a 2019 LP Traditional .
Cheers

I love that you basically have a demo for every amp I have a question about. lol

You happen to have a SC20h? Haha

 

[Mitchell Pearrow]

https://youtu.be/bZ5UHfZLbP
Here is another clip of both of the amps working together.
Thanks

 

[Whizzinby]

IMO, the Origin is the amp Marshall never wanted to release because it's a foundational Marshall amp upon which you can add pedals to make it sound like nearly every other Marshall amp on the market. Marshall amps have a pre-amp stage that heavily colors the Marshall's tone. You can't get rid of it (and why would you as it's the reason you got it) and even the clean channels have their color. The Origin, however, is very different as the gain has more headroom and the pre-amp stage coloring is not so dense. When the amp is cranked with no pedals you hit hard rock/very early metal and no more. So with that sort of headroom and plain palette to paint from, Marshall knows the right pedals before it, especially a good pre-amp pedal can turn it into anything else they have. Origin is really a no brainer for anyone who already has developed such a pedal selection.

Marshall has likely offset the costs for the Origin IMO. My guess is that the premium price of the studio series helps cover the lower costs of Origin. This is how they are competing with profilers, lunchbox series amps, and Fender type pedal taking heads.

Thanks for the feedback.

I’m going to try it out with my Riverside and Plumes pedals, hopefully today.

Pending that I’d have to decide between getting the 50c or getting a head version and pairing it with a 2x12.

If the Origin with my pedals doesn’t speak to me I’m probably going to get a 2x12 and then figure out if I want to go the SC20H route or another brand.

 

[Mitchell Pearrow]

I love that you basically have a demo for every amp I have a question about. lol

You happen to have a SC20h? Haha

Yes I do ha ha it was made in a GC

 

[Mitchell Pearrow]

This was done in a GC in Fountain Valley CA.
Cheers

 

[scozz]

And side note since I’m looking at other more expensive amps, does anyone have the Marshall Studio Classic 20w, and would it be noticeably different than then DSL tonally? Apparently is the 20w version of the JCM800.

Well if I were you I’d definitely check out the SC20, it’s a great sounding amp, but it’s really only one channel if that’s a concern for you.

It has a great big full pristine clean tone in the low sensitivity input, which kinda acts as another channel, but no channel switching of course.

The SC20 does a remarkable job in capturing the tone the Jcm800 is so well known for, and is a worthy stalwart In doing so.

In my opinion the SC20s tone is quite noticeably different from the Dsl line, I own both. You should read a few pages of this thread,...it’s only over 200 pages with over 4000 replies!,.....

http://www.marshallforum.com/threads/the-official-marshall-studio-classic-thread-sc20.105824/


Also the SC20 responds remarkably well with working the guitars volume to clean up the tone. It’s just a great amp in all respects imo.

You’d be doing yourself a disservice, imo, if you didn’t check it out before you make your purchase

 

[Whizzinby]

Alright gentlemen. Went back to the shop. Tried out the Origin with my Riverside pedal and then the Mini Rectifier.

Origin: Granted I didn’t have enough time to dial the amp in to perfectly, but stacked with the Riverside and it sounded fairly good. I still noticed a small lack of articulation when playing with big time saturated gain, (One of the issues I have with the DSL) but otherwise I’m starting to pick out the Marshall characteristics which both the DSL clearly have. Would be curious to see the Origin with a clean boost.

Then played the Mini Rectifier with a 2x12. Only 25w but does pack a punch. It’s hard to turn the volume above 10 o’clock. Interestingly it’s a very bright amp, especially on cleans. I give it pretty high marks for clean tones. On the gain channel it is punchy and can get as saturated as you’d want, and tbh very hard to take out of 10w mode. I will say it lacks some articulation under high gain too. (The only amp I’ve played to this point that I would say excelled at that under saturation was the Triple Crown)

So I thought pretty hard, and tbh I probably would have gotten the Mini Rec and Cab if it were not for the fact that I’d have to take a real haircut selling the DSL to this shop vs GC where I can get a full refund. (But don’t sell the Mini, smh) So I exercised some patience and kept the DSL, and then traded in a few pedals for the Mesa 2x12 cab. (Sad to see the Deco and Riverside go, but they were still in the return window at this shop, and basically it was straight three pedals for a cab which I’m happy with)

So, disconnected the DSL speaker and plugged in the Mesa cab and I’ll be damned but it does make a difference. The V30’s have a tighter low end punch without being boomy, and the mids are a more clean and present without being overbearing. Only got to play for about 20 minutes before the high priced show pony pulled me away for “family time” lmao.

I still heard some of the negatives I have with the DSL but it really is a different sound out of the cab and I think it’s at least warranting a few days of further knob fiddling.

That said with the cab now I’ll need to go to a head setup, rather than combo, but it will be tough. Will see if I can dial in the DSL combo enough with this setup to see if I’d want to dip the toes back in the water for a DSL head, (Thinking would take a miracle, but who knows) or revert to the Origin as a pedal setup, or try the SC20H, or the Mini Rec.

 

[Whizzinby]

The new setup, for now...

 

[Mitchell Pearrow]

The new setup, for now...

View attachment 75500

Looks great, bet it gets better as the speakers break in, looks similar to how I set mine up.[url=https://postimg.cc/JGWwMjjS][/URL]
Hope you get it all worked out bro.
Mitch

 

[Whizzinby]

SkyMonkey,

Reconfirm how I get all three speaker working.

There are three jacks:
1x16
1x8 - 2x16
1x4 - 2x8

Currently I have the 2x12 cab in the 1x4 - 2x8 jack because the cab has two 8ohm speakers.

I cannot simply plug the stock speaker in the combo into the 1x16 jack and have them play nice? (Youre saying that by using the 1x16 jack it will shut off the use of the other jacks?)

 

[Whizzinby]

Looks great, bet it gets better as the speakers break in, looks similar to how I set mine up.
Hope you get it all worked out bro.
Mitch

Killer setup. How do you utilize the two?

 

[Bruce Campbell]

That said with the cab now I’ll need to go to a head setup, rather than combo, but it will be tough. Will see if I can dial in the DSL combo enough with this setup to see if I’d want to dip the toes back in the water for a DSL head, (Thinking would take a miracle, but who knows) or revert to the Origin as a pedal setup, or try the SC20H, or the Mini Rec.

There's always this StageCraft cab for the DSL40CR.
https://www.stagecraftgear.com/product/dsl-40cr-head/

I haven't even received my DSL40CR yet (on order) and I've been eyeing this cab up.

Cheers !
B

 

[Clayton Custom Cabs]

Welcome to the MF @Whizzinby

I have a DSL40CR and I can throw in my 2 cents (for what it's worth).

1. Probably best to just post a pic of my current knob settings:

View attachment 75106

The caveat is that I run the 40CR in MIDI controlled 4CM with a Boss GT-100, so there is some external EQ'ing going on (but not much).

BTW I don't play live. These are bedroom volume settings. Plus, I have changed the speaker to a G12 Century Vintage and run the V-Type in a 112 cab under the DSL.​

2. See above.

3. In general terms (and I know I will get shouted at) the channel Gain sets the amount of distortion, channel Volume sets the channel volume (!) and is used to balance the relative volumes of the Classic and Ultra channels.
Master Volumes actually choke the preamp volume before it gets to the power amp.
To make a DSL40CR into a non-MV amp simply turn the Masters to 10.
The 2 Master Volumes can be used to create a level boost (Solo) for the amp, or to balance the inherent volume discrepancy between the Classic Clean and Classic Crunch channels (i.e. assign MV1 to Classic Clean and MV2 to Classic Crunch and the Ultras).
I think the general consensus is that the volume discrepancy is more marked with lower gain settings on the Classic channels.
I still find I can get a clean enough tone for my needs with the Classic Gain at 10 (clean up further with guitar volume knob).
At 10 I get the Crunch I like without an additional OD (and with!).

4. Pres and Res I know little about, but what I have gathered is that they are negative feedback circuits. So as you turn either one up you are actually reducing the negative feedback at either high or low frequencies (I think). Reducing negative feedback allows a frequency to stand out more (negative feedback supresses).
Some prefer to use Pres instead of Treble to control the high frequencies (i.e. Treble @ 0). Play around with the two!
Also, I think that whilst noon is generally the neutral setting for EQ knobs, for Pres and Res 0 is the neutral setting.
There is a lot more to it though.
Try reading this: http://blog.hughes-and-kettner.com/presence-resonance-and-eq-settings-for-a-great-live-guitar-tone/

5. I don't use the Tone Shift. I have read that some use it for Single Coil guitars.

One thing about the high gain setting of the 40CR (in my experience) is that the Ultras (esp. OD2) seem to mush up and compress (volume dips) with the Gain set above 6-7. To get a better 'articulated' high gain tone I use an OD (from the GT-100) in front of the preamp.
I can get higher gain tones I like with lower amp gain, and pushing the preamp with a neutral OD (and I love my high gain).

We are all different and tone is subjective.
Play with your knobs and have fun

Well said.

 

[Mitchell Pearrow]

Killer setup. How do you utilize the two?

Mostly depends on what I am going for at the time I turn them on, if I am going old school, I plug them into the MXR10 band eq, they’re both EQ’d the same, with a touch of reverb (from the amp)
If I am looking to hear FX or Doom I use the Vox Tone Lab,
I can get a close Trower, to a Black Sabbath, and just about anything else I am after. And if I am looking for a huge thick wall of sound I turn on the Origin’s and the other 3210 lead 100 mosfet, and turn it up to 4-5 that slays.
I will bring a recent example.

 

[Mitchell Pearrow]

This is all six amps, I am using the MXR10 band eq to push the Dsl40c’s, that are feeding the Origin’s, my volume is only at 2 on the red 2 ultra of the Dsl40c’s, sorry if I have posted this clip already. But it did (for a cell phone) capture the tone I heard.
Thanks

 

[Carlos G]

I found that cutting a little on the gain can make the distortion shine way better and be more articulate. On the crunch channel I get a great sound by setting the gain around eleven o'clock, treble at eleven, mids at around one o'clock, same as bass, presence at 10 and resonance at 2 o'clock and reverb as desired, but I set it at around 3 o'clock because I find it a little weak. On the Ultra gain channel OD1, I set the gain at noon, treble at 10, same as mids, bass at 3 o'clock, presence at 10 and resonance at noon. I keep the tone shift button always out, and, very important, the volume always at full on both channels and adjust volume as desired with the masters. It might need a little tweaking depending on the room and your guitar, but give it a shot and let me know how it works for you. Saludos!