How to get a saturated, van halen sounding tone out of a jcm 800 2203?

[X2203xman]

I think the single channel 800 gets you really close to Plexi tone and brown sound with the master at 4 and the gain at 7 or so, pushed with a decent OD pedal and Greenback speakers. For my 2203X, I set the Presence = 4, Bass = 10, Mids = 5 and Treble = 4 or so.

DP

I'm with you DP,the 2203x gets those tones pretty easily.I would go as far as saying with the gain on 8,and the master at noon,you may not need a boost.You know DP,with the bright cap swap on my 2203x,it really sounds a lot like the 1987.My eq is very close to yours.My presence is on 2,or 3,and my bass is around 3,or so.I like the mids at 5,to 7,and the treble around 4 like you.

 

[BeardedRetroGuy]

For me it looks and sounds smoother when one blends his style with the song he is copying. Also more fun to have your own sound. Just my thoughts. Bob

What if your style is that you HAVE no style?

Well, except that I add my own 3-note touch harmonics when I play Evanescence - Bring Me To Life. But that's about it.

 

[Dmann]

I never understood why guys want to sound like someone else' Chasing EVH sound to the extreme. To me one should make their own sound. Even EVH said he hated trying to copy other guitars players and why he invented his style and sound.

As others I love plaing VH songs and classics by other great guitar players but I try to sound like myself also. I never try to do note for note copy' mainly because I see guys who try this and they sound like Robots. For me it looks and sounds smoother when one blends his style with the song he is copying. Also more fun to have your own sound. Just my thoughts. Bob

Obviously as one becomes experienced their views and goals change, imitation is where it all begins though, so in that respect I find it hard to believe that everyone does not start out trying to sound like someone else.

I mean how else can you learn about tone and effects and how to achieve what you want from them if you don't spend the time trying to get sounds that others have gotten?

 

[rick16v]

Deja Vu lol.

Van Halen doing Grunge before there was Grunge!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0peSQnpDobQ

Never heard that before. It really is a grunge blue print!!

 

[NewReligion]

Never heard that before. It really is a grunge blue print!!

Right on....one just needs to open the mind and it all comes into focus. Think outside of the box...Look at the schematics then work in your own variations.

Mott555 and I usually/often agree on many things but on the subject of arriving at the real browned out sound and feel we will just have to agree to disagree as I still know 50 year old bad ass guitarist's trying to nail down certain saturated definitions and string articulation with adding a certain different pedal into a "for the most part" stock 1987/1959/2203/2204. Not happening IMO. Once you have laid hands on the real deal it is breath taking.

As I often do my best to caution...I realize I am opinionated but have been at this a looooong time and really in deep over the last six years.

After owning and studying some previously professionally owned amps that I now own I swear to you there is in fact a huge difference between a stock Marshall plus a pedal and a not half ass'd but all out hot rod circuit...in fact a completely different amp once you realize that for that "tone" there is little if any need for parts of the circuits from the 50's/60's that keep the amp clean. I will only say...you do not need a OD pedal, extra tube or clipping diode.

I will say no more on the subject. I started out trying to emulate Tones from Don Dokken's up from the Ashes and EVH from VH I & II but ended up with my own circuit which is indeed unique. It is easy to get the saturation but to balance and tune the EQ is another challenge all together IMO. This (and a couple other issues) is what separates builders like Scott Splawn locked in mid hump from Master builders such as David Friedman and M Cameron etc...

Much respect to you all.

Here is a close up of one of my variations on a couple themes. I busted ass on day and night over the last six months. It is the time you put in and log that equals experience in engineering in addition to education and knowing who to listen to and who to avoid due to misdirection, smoke and mirrors etc...

I am about to embark on 100 watt variations and take saturation to an extreme while maintaining clarity, sustain, harmonics and punch in addition to my signature tone which = voltages, tone stacks, OT's etc... etc... etc... all with triodes (12A_7) preamp tubes.

If you do enough research you will learn that Ed knew where he was going and what he wanted. He was fortunate enough to meet a couple guys to help him develop more stable circuits. Too bad it ended up with the engineers at Peavey. I do have an interest in the new reworked Fender 5150III (Stealth) as long as the fizz is tamed.

David ♫ Rock until you Drop! I apologize if I have offended anyone.

Straight in at conversation level.
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H12qoOGvH28[/ame]

Same circuit with a different tone stack all together and voltage rating:
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfhE58waICM[/ame]

 

[EndGame00]

David Bray's amps has some EVH flavors on his plexis, but I still think Mark Abrahamian has pretty much nail it to the T....

I know none of my clones are gonna come close to the first VH...

 

[lespaul1981]

EVH ran everything on 10 on his plexi...but an 800 is a bit different IMO.
With an 800 I'd start w presence 7-8, Bass noonish, Mids 7-8, Treble 7-8, Master 8, Gain noonish. Hit it with an EQ doing a frown EQ curve for a mid boost.
Play into warm greenback or blackback type speakers.
Have a guitar that has a tele/strat twang with a humbucker warmth and definition.
Add some plate verb and delay for a 3-D type larger/bigger than it really is vibe. Adding verb such as EMT140 type Plate does a lot more than I had realized when trying to get that tone.

Start there, and check out Metro Amp's forum. There are some serious EVH tone chasers over there.

Good luck!

 

[sidvicious]

like all the ac/dc threads, i've just never found a vh tone that difficult to nail.

its neck and strings more than anything else.

 

[medicjg]

Nope ...


You need one of these ... and all your problems will be solved !

Alright tubes you have me interested. How much?

 

[flyinguitars]

Here my kid on a jcm800 with an attenuator right after he got it (the attenuator). This is speaking volume and recorded with a phone.
Attenuate or get a nice pedal (like onfloor) and you should get close

Mobile link: https://youtu.be/QEl_z3TcLiY[ame]www.youtube.com/watch?v=QEl_z3TcLiY[/ame]

 

[Garrett]

Well done, you have to be one proud parent!!!

 

[pittbull]

The best amp I’ve played(I’ve played them all stock and modded)and still own (would never sell)is Rockstah mod 5 for the Van Halen 1 sound. I have the last amp that Mark A.(RIP)modded before he passed away.it’s a Rockitt Retro 1968 50 watt plexi spec that I sent to Mark A. to mod.I had the Rockstah Amplification logo made that’s the logo Mark A. designed but passed away before he had a chance to make them .

 

[Matthews Guitars]

I do believe that the recordings on VH and VH II were done on amps that really were mostly stock, but run the way Eddie ran them, on a variac. Sure, in later years his tone quest would lead him to use amps that were progressively farther and farther away from a pure plexi circuit, but in the beginning years, I would not be surprised at all to find that some of his amps were not modded with regard to affecting tone. And that is what is reported to be the case with at least one of his early amps that is preserved "as last played" complete with set list still taped to the front of it.

If you are chasing the EVH tone, ask WHICH EVH tone you are chasing. Because there's not just one. His tone changed on almost every album.

For at least the first two albums, you don't need a lot of gain. Listen carefully. There's not all THAT much preamp distortion, but what you are hearing is the power stage going into saturation, and don't forget...this was usually done with a variac taking the line voltage down to somewhere around 90 volts.

 

[pittbull]

Van Halen 1 sound(first album) would be the tone for the majority of guitar players

 

[gregr]

I only read the thread title. Wampler Pinnacle into the low gain input.

Now that I typed that I need to go back and look to see if there’s any mention of a variac, and even that is tenuous. 2203 ain’t a 1959 and you don’t get VH1 on a 1959 without a variac; or you can’t identify the brown sound in which case, sure, use your 2203 with MXR Script 90, MXR flanger, an echoplex and channel Eddie’s hands with your 2203. Why not?

Don’t want to use a solid state pedal? Then get a Friedman.

/zealous rant

 

[pittbull]

Many guitarist have tried including myself the cranked Marshall plexi variac lower thing and it doesn’t sound like the Van Halen 1 sound

 

[gregr]

And yet that’s what EVH did.

 

[pittbull]

One of the things he did BUT there was more that’s not being explained

 

[gregr]

Like what?

 

[pittbull]

That’s what we don’t know